Out of Hours: The Podcast
DHH: Building Basecamp and Ruby on Rails as side projects, with David Heinemeier Hansson
Brought to you by Out of Hours- the community of people with side projects.
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Today on the podcast is David Heinemeier Hansson: the co-founder and CTO of Basecamp, a NYT best selling author, and creator of Ruby on Rails.
Ruby on rails is a free open source web application framework. and some of the biggest companies in the world were built with it: Airbnb, Shopify, Twitch and Square to name a few.
He’s also built hugely successful businesses: Basecamp - which started as a side project for him and his cofounder Jason. It has since made him a millionaire, and served millions of users.
Alongside all of this, he is also an author. He’s written three books, including New York Times Bestseller Rework. He’s also a Le Mans class-winning racing driver.
Even though he started all his biggest projects as side projects, this is not a traditional podcast episode - we talk much more about the other meaning of ‘out of hours’ - the fact we are running out of hours and life should be meaningful. We talk about everything from:
- open source
- why intrinsic motivation matters
- why he was a terrible employee
- how to build your internal sense of control
- why he doesn’t set goals
- how he found out money doesn’t make him happy
- whether he’ll ever go into politics
- climate change
P.S. If you enjoy this episode, consider buying me a coffee to show your support! ☕️ We currently make a loss on the show and your support means the world!
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2. Kevin Kelly, on How to Find Your Purpose, and Excellent Advice for Living and his Favourite Self Help Books.47:09Want to say thanks for this episode and encourage future episodes? You can now Buy Me A Coffee! 💛☕️(You can also email me on email@example.com)Kevin Kelly is the founding executive editor of Wired magazine and a former editor and publisher of the Whole Earth Review. He has also been a writer, photographer, conservationist, and student of Asian and digital culture.He is also co-chair of The Long Now Foundation, a membership organisation that champions long-term thinking. He is founder of the popular Cool Tools website, which has been reviewing tools daily for 20 years. He is also the author of multiple best-selling books about the future of technology. His newest is Excellent Advice for Living, a book of 450 modern proverbs for a pretty good life. In this episode we talk about:What makes good advice (and is there such thing as original advice?)Why language is important for using advice wellWhy he wasn't in love when he got married but is nowThe self-help books that actually changed his behaviourWhy you shouldn't wear a hat with more personality than you Why he admires Jeff Bezos every time he meets himPlease enjoy!
1. Edward Sullivan: on Building Healthy Work Cultures, Finding Your Zone of Genius, and Starting a Successful Coaching Business.48:34Welcome to Out of Hours.Joining the podcast today is Edward Sullivan, co-founder and CEO of Velocity coaching, best selling author of Leading with Heart and executive coach. His twenty-five-year career as an executive coach and political consultant has taken him around the globe coaching and advising start-up founders, Fortune 500 CEOs, and heads of state of foreign nations. His work has been featured in The New York Times, The Washington Post, Harvard Business Review, Forbes, Fast Company, INC., USA Today and more. We talk about finding your zone of genius, on falling into coaching by mistake, what a ski time CEO is (vs war time or peace time CEO), fear led work cultures vs heart based cultures and so much more!☕️ Like the show? Buy me a coffee to show your appreciation!
6. Matt Booshell, Becoming a comedian and musician with Matt Buechele57:32If you enjoy this episode, please buy me a coffee and send a message to show your support! ☕️Today on the podcast we have Matt Buechele - known on instagram as Matt Booshell. You may recognise Matt from his comedic, straight-to-camera one minute monologues - as he walks through the street of new york with his airpods. He is a writer, comedian, and composer. He has always been interested in comedy, music and sketches - and today he is full time on his creative work - having written for the Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon and having had his work featured on place like Netflix and Comedy Central. We talk about why fear is irrational, why putting his work online was so key for his success, and why he thinks all musicians want to be comedians and all comedians want to be musicians. I hope you enjoy!
5. Allbirds: Building a sustainable shoe brand, with Tim Brown.53:11If you enjoy this episode, please buy me a coffee to show your support! ☕️Today on the podcast we have Tim Brown, co-founder of Allbirds. Today Allbirds is a public company, with an IPO in 2021, and almost one thousand employees. But it didn’t start that way. In fact for many years, Allbirds was just an idea, a side project for Tim Brown - who was a professional footballer for the first part of his career, even playing in the world cup. Tim was bored of the branded shoes he had to wear as a footballer, and started to wonder if a better shoe could be made. For years, he experimented. Tim is a New Zealander, which is the home of merino wool, and he started experimenting with creating a new shoe material with his homegrown merino wool. After he had a prototype shoe, he launched a kickstarter - which proved the idea was popular with others. In 2016 - Tim officially co-founded Allbirds with his cofounder Joey Zwillinger - who helped shape the sustainability focus for the company. They are now a carbon neutral company, and were termed the ‘world’s most comfortable shoe’ by time magazine.We talk about tall poppy syndrome, why he thinks a sense of humour matters in entrepreneurship, and why he thinks the 85% rule of effort is so important. I hope you enjoy. Join the Out of Hours newsletter here! If you enjoy this episode, consider buying me a coffee to show your support! ☕️ Your support shows me it's worth continuing!
4. Embracing truth, fear and your inner dialogue as a celebrity life coach, with Lauren Zander59:40If you enjoy this episode, consider buying me a coffee to show your support! ☕️Today on the show we have Lauren Zander, life coach and author of the book “Maybe it’s You” - offering a step-by-step process that has transformed the lives of tens of thousands of her clients. Following a realisation that she’d been living a life full of lies, she decided to “clean up her life” and tell the truth. The result was a lifelong successful career in life coaching and writing. She was in the first vanguard of life coaches, a newly emerging industry, and counts the well known life coach Mel Robbins as one of her early clients. She’s also the coach of Hugh Jackman, the actor in Wolverine and Greatest Showman, who has cited her practice as a “slap taken” - a dose of reality and motivation when preparing for the Greatest Showman. We talk about why people are so afraid to commit fully to their projects, why lying makes our lives so unenjoyable, and why she doesn’t care that coaching isn’t an industry for everyone.If you enjoy this episode, consider buying me a coffee to show your support! ☕️ Your support shows us it's worth continuing!
3. Wait But Why: Building a media business, with Tim Urban53:42If you enjoy this episode, consider buying me a coffee to show your support! ☕️ We currently make a loss on the show and your support means the world!Today on the show we have Tim Urban. Tim’s TED talk - Inside the mind of a master procrastinator - is now the third most watched TED talk in the world - totalling over 65 million views. Tim is also one of the internet’s most thought provoking writers, he started his blog Wait But Why - originally as an attempt to exercise his creative side, only to find it resonated with many many others.Wait But Why’s longform articles have since attracted millions of views, and over 700,000 subscribers. He is famous for his long form essays on everything from The Fermi Paradox and intelligent aliens, to why we should spend more time with our parents. He's also about to release a new book called What's Our Problem?: A Self-Help Book for Societies.Tim is a lesson in how you can build a career following your own weird and wonderful curiosity. We talk less about his interests and more about his process; how he started and grew Wait But Why, how he structures his writing process, how he manages his procrastination and why he thinks there is no objectively cool job. I hope you enjoy!Sign up to the Out of Hours newsletter (we only post occasionally):https://outofhours.substack.com/
2. Prison Yoga Project: Building trauma-informed yoga programmes, with James Fox53:22If you enjoy this episode, consider buying me a coffee to show your support! ☕️ We currently make a loss on the show and your support means the world!(or, support me on the podcast app Fountain!)Today on the show we have James Fox, the founder of Prison Yoga Project.Yoga changed the course of James’ life, and in 2002, he started his own organisation - Prison Yoga Project - a programme to teach trauma informed yoga and bring yoga and mindfulness to prisons. 70% of prisoners return to the community there is a 76% re-arrest rate within the first 5 years. Prison Yoga Project supports incarcerated people with trauma-informed yoga and mindfulness. Their goal is to help reduce reoffending and providing a more humane experience for incarcerated people. James also has written a book about yoga and sent thousands of copies to prisoners who have requested them.He began the programme in the US, in San Quentin, and has now brought the practice global - from the U.K., to Mexico to Australia.In this episode, we talk about the male role complex, how trauma is stored in the body, and why everyone should support yoga in prison if they want a safer and more humane society.If you’re interested in supporting Prison Yoga Project - they run a book program, which supplies a free book to any inmate who requests one. If you’re interested in a trauma-informed approach to yoga instruction, you can train with Prison Yoga Project. Just head to PrisonYoga.org.Sign up to Out of Hours newsletter here.
1. Deliciously Ella: Building a plant-based movement, with Ella Mills47:28Enjoyed this episode? Consider buying me a coffee! ☕️ We currently make a loss on the show and your support means the world!Today on the podcast we have Ella Mils, the founder of Deliciously Ella.Ella started Deliciously Ella - a blog for plant based recipes - over ten years ago when she was still at university. Having been diagnosed with a chronic condition, and being in and out of hospital with drugs having no meaningful impact, she turned to the internet. Originally she started the blog as just a personal project - but she eventually released it to the public - gaining over 130 million hits within the next few years. Buoyed by this success, she launched an app, which went straight to #1 in the UK app store for food & drink , thanks to the growing online community she is so known for today. Her debut cook book became the best-selling debut cookbook of all time in the UK. Together with her husband Matt, she has grown the business even further - expanding into a deli which is now their flagship restaurant, as well as many new food products listed in places like Waitrose, Starbucks, Tesco and Sainsburys. We talk about why building moments of calm is so important, what people get wrong about plant based diet, her skin care routine, and why she doesn’t want to be famous. I hope you enjoy!Sign up to the Out of Hours newsletter hereOr follow us on Instagram.
Season 4: The Trailer01:11We are BACK! From next week, we'll be posting weekly episodes with some of the most exciting people who have followed their curiosity and started things on the side - only for them to turn into something much bigger than they expected.Subscribe to catch the first episode!If you enjoy the show, consider buying me a coffee to show your support! ☕️ We currently make a loss on the show and your support means the world!