What Comes After What Comes Next

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Why we must listen to indigenous voices with Hindou Oumarou Ibrahim

Season 2, Ep. 4

When Hindou Oumarou Ibrahim was a child, Lake Chad in her home country spanned 10,000 km2. Today, because of climate change, it is around a tenth of that size.


As Hindou puts its "climate change is not about our future, it's about our present.”


Hindou is an expert in the adaptation and mitigation of indigenous peoples to climate change. She is a member of the Mbororo pastoralist people in Chad and President of the Association for Indigenous Women and Peoples of Chad (AFPAT). Oumarou Ibrahim is an advocate for the greater inclusion of indigenous people and their knowledge and traditions in the global movement to fight the effects of climate change. 


Soon after we started talking Hindou reminded me that "when you are born an indigenous person, you are born an activist for the environment.” 


On the one hand, this is an upsetting conversation about the impact climate change is having right now on indigenous peoples all over the world. On the other hand, it is an inspiring, hopeful conversation about our capacity to build a better, cleaner, low carbon future.


As always, we'd love to hear your thoughts and feedback at james.shaw@parliament.govt.nz


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More Episodes

5/27/2021

Telling stories with Barbara Kingsolver

Season 2, Ep. 5
This week James catches up with award winning author Barbara Kingsolver, whose work over the last three decades has eloquently and movingly touched on matters of genuine social and environmental concern.Most notably, Barbara's novel Flight Behaviour conveyed the impact of climate change on a community, an ecosystem and a species. The novel also draws out the tension that can exist between one's everyday life and the changes happening around us, of which we can feel powerless to address on our own. This is particularly evident in the life of the novel's main character, Dellarobia, who tries to make sense of the unexpected arrival of a flock of monarch butterflies and what it might mean for the future while struggling with the challenges of poverty and her own family. Running through Barbara's work over the last 30 years has been a real sense of place - from her early books in Arizona, to the Poisonwood Bible, to Flight Behaviour. She has also written a number of books with more than a passing reference to the natural world, including Small Wonder and Animal, Vegetable, Miracle.Most recently Barbara contributed a poem to a Time magazine special report called 2050: The Fight for the Earth, which provides a powerful look at the politics of consumption, equality, and climate change.Halfway through the episode Barbara treats us to a very special reading of the poem. Some of the most popular podcast episodes we've published so far have been those that look at climate change through a slightly different lens. In the last series it was legendary music producer Brian Eno who spoke to James about what different models and structures for making music can teach us about how to organise society and our politics. Today we are delighted to bring you another unique perspective on the role art and literature can play in helping address the climate crisis. As always, we'd love to hear your thoughts and feedback atjames.shaw@parliament.govt.nz.Follow James onTwitter,Facebook, andInstagram.