The Business of Fashion Podcast

Khalid Al Tayer, Managing Director of Al Tayer Insignia and CEO of the luxury e-commerce platform Ounass, leads one of the Middle East’s most powerful retail networks. In his first public interview at Oud Fashion Talks, Al Tayer shares insights into the rapid evolution of the Middle Eastern luxury market, the region's growing influence on global trends, and how his business approaches e-commerce with a customer-first mindset. He also discusses the strategic importance of respecting and investing in the Middle Eastern customer while creating opportunities for regional talent to flourish in the luxury landscape.“The brands that have taken [the Middle Eastern] customer as a very important customer and respect them are seeing benefit. The ones that approach this customer as, ‘They’re just going to buy what we make, and we’re going to do … a good enough job because we’re busy somewhere else,’ are not benefiting. Respect the Middle Eastern customer,” shares Al Tayer.This week on The BoF Podcast, BoF founder and editor-in-chief Imran Amed sits down with Al Tayer to discuss the growing influence of the Middle Eastern luxury market and how businesses can succeed by prioritising the evolving needs of the regional customer.Key Insights: Despite challenges in global luxury, Al Tayer points to the Middle East as a resilient outlier in the industry, especially post-Covid. Brand investment in top-tier store experiences, thoughtful activations, and tailored assortments have fostered a deeper connection with the local customer. “The Middle East … has been a shining candle in the industry generally because of the resilience and the growing sophistication of the Middle Eastern customer,” Al Tayer notes, attributing this shift to brands recognising the importance of this loyal market.Al Tayer forecasts that e-commerce will soon make up half of all luxury retail in the region, with Ounass already pushing double-digit growth in this area. “In the next few years … 50 percent of the sales of retail will be online,” he says, describing an evolving model he calls “luxury convenience.” While physical stores will still offer unparalleled experiences, online platforms like Ounass meet the growing demand for digital access and seamless customer journeys.Al Tayer attributes his company’s success to “fanatical focus” and the dedication of his team. “First and foremost, it's all about team and surrounding yourself with the right people,” he says. “I try to build trust by allowing them to have ownership. When they have ownership, they really drive the business like it's their own.” In an industry that requires high levels of execution, he recommends patience and focusing on the details that matter. “Focus on what you’re doing and get it right,” he advises, urging new entrepreneurs to remain committed and data-driven.Additional Resources:BoF Insights | Fashion in the Middle East: Optimism and Transformation What Escalation in the Middle East War Means for the Industry | BoF 

Online shopping promises convenience, but finding the right product among thousands – or hundreds of thousands – of options can often feel like a chore. To address this, retailers are experimenting with AI tools that aim to cut through the clutter with improved search capabilities and personalised shopping experiences. These models don’t just match keywords; they understand user intent and interpret complex search terms, moving closer to a more personal shopping experience online.“Search works really well when you know specifically what you're looking for,” senior technology correspondent Marc Bain notes, “but there’s potential for AI to bridge that gap when you don’t.”This week on The Debrief, BoF executive editor Brian Baskin and senior correspondent Sheena Butler-Young sit down with Bain to explore how AI is transforming e-commerce.Key Insights: New AI search tools are evolving past traditional keyword searches, enhancing users’ ability to find what they’re looking for online with greater ease. “These large language models could change search in a way that you can interact with it more naturally,” explains Bain. With AI’s advanced understanding of nuanced searches like “what should I wear to Burning Man?”, these systems can now deliver results based on context, location, and style preferences, making online shopping a more seamless, intuitive experience.AI in e-commerce aims to serve as an attentive, personalised assistant, but brands face the challenge of enhancing the customer experience while maintaining a respectful distance in the digital space. AI must fall on “the right side of the line between concierge and creepy,” Baskin explains. "The ideal is having an online sales associate … where it doesn’t feel like … it’s just throwing products at you to see what sticks,” continues Bain. The goal of AI in e-commerce is to make shopping more intuitive by simplifying search. As Bain notes, “search is notoriously terrible on retail e-commerce sites,” highlighting the need for improvement. However, despite these advancements, consumers may remain hesitant to fully trust AI-driven recommendations. Bain reflects this sentiment, adding, “I would probably look at what it says and then still go do my own research because I don’t fully trust it.” Additional Resources:The E-Commerce Search Bar Gets an AI Makeover | BoF How AI Could Change Online Product Search and Discovery | BoFCase Study | How to Create the Perfect E-Commerce Site | BoF

Growing up in Hamburg with a photographer father and a stepmother who ran a vintage boutique, Robert Geller was immersed in the world of fashion, art and creativity from a young age. His journey from Marc Jacobs intern to co-founder of cult New York fashion label Cloak to creative director at Rag & Bone is the result of his personal philosophy of saying yes to new opportunities. “The key thing is saying yes. Just do it and try it. It's always better to do something than not to do it,” shared Geller. “Even if it doesn't go right, you learn a ton from it. You're always better off going out and trying something."This week on the BoF Podcast, founder and CEO Imran Amed sits down with Geller to explore his journey, learn about the ups and downs of building an independent fashion label, and why he’s taken on his new role as creative director at Rag & Bone.Key Insights: Growing up, Geller was deeply influenced by his creative surroundings and his stepmother played a pivotal role in shaping his fashion sensibilities. “She owned a second-hand store in Hamburg, but she only sold Japanese fashion labels,” he recalls, pointing to brands like Comme des Garçons and Yohji Yamamoto. Trips with her to Paris, where she would take him to “beautiful boutiques,” ignited his passion for fashion. “At a very young age, I really enjoyed it. I sort of found the magic of fashion in these places and in these clothes.”Geller’s first major venture in fashion, Cloak, became a cult label in New York in the early 2000s. Geller left Cloak after the A/W 2004 collection, with the brand finally closing down in 2007. As Geller candidly explains, “We were not really focusing on making money. We didn’t know how to do it, but we knew how to make great clothes and how to put on fun shows.” The purity of vision behind Cloak was undeniable, but it ultimately lacked the business foundation needed for sustainability.  While Geller has always embraced creativity, he also understands the importance of balancing it with the practicalities of running a business. “I respect the need for the sales and need for the business, that’s the fuel,” he says. “One cannot exist without the other. You can’t have a collection without getting the business right and having sales,” Geller adds.After years of running his own label, Geller made the leap to become creative director at Rag & Bone in 2023. Reflecting on his approach, he says, “It just needed another layer of excitement... I felt like it was lacking conversations, the exciting pieces, the layer on top that really exemplified the peak of the brand.” Geller’s vision involves integrating the brand's core strengths, like denim, with modern elements to create a cohesive, elevated collection. “It’s not a revolution... we're just trying to layer something on top that’s exciting.”Additional Resources:Groundhog Day at Rag & Bone | BoFMarcus Wainwright on Rag & Bone and Going It Alone | BoF A Different Kind of Dream at Rag & Bone | BoF

A growing number of direct-to-consumer brands are disrupting the luxury market by offering high-quality alternatives at more affordable prices. As traditional luxury brands focus on the ultra-wealthy and fast fashion dominates the budget market, these “dupe” brands cater to middle-class consumers who feel priced out of luxury but still want value for their money. Through transparent pricing and savvy use of social media, they are reshaping how consumers think about value and quality.“The term dupe stems from duplication, but it also does speak to consumer sentiment around pricing today - they do feel duped,” says e-commerce correspondent Malique Morris. “Luxury brands have exponentially raised their prices for hip products in a way that is locking out middle class shoppers who typically could splurge on a few nice bags or a few nice sweaters a year.” Key insights:As luxury brands continue to hike prices for their most popular products, middle-class consumers are feeling increasingly excluded from the luxury market. This sentiment is fueling the rise of brands like Quince and Italic. “Luxury brands have exponentially raised their prices for hip products in a way that is locking out middle class shoppers who typically could splurge on a few nice bags or a few nice sweaters a year,” says Morris. “The check is going to come due for luxury brands to explain why their prices are so high.”Dupe brands take advantage of this dynamic by being open about their costs, breaking down exactly how much it takes to produce their items and what they’re selling them for. “Dupe brands are almost annoyingly transparent about pricing in terms of breaking down,” Morris explains. “That’s refreshing for middle-class shoppers who are seeing the prices of things like milk and eggs rise inexplicably. Outside of this vague bogeyman of inflation, their dreams of owning a Chanel bag is moving further away with no real explanation on that front either.” Platforms like TikTok and Instagram have been instrumental in the rise of dupe brands, where influencers showcase cheaper alternatives to high-end products. However, the sustainability of this trend is uncertain. “If consumers stop caring about dupes and engagement goes down, then social media leverage on this front will die out for these brands, but right now, it really is a boon for them,” says Morris.While price is the main draw for dupe brands now, they will need to evolve beyond being simply the cheaper alternative. “What is our differentiator beyond offering good prices now? What is our storytelling? What are our products that are unique to us? If dupe brands can answer those questions, they’ll stop being seen as just cheaper versions,” says Morris. Additional Resources:What Luxury ‘Dupe’ Brands Get Right About Shoppers | BoF Is Dupe Culture Out of Control? | BoF

Michelle Yeoh has captivated audiences for decades, from her iconic role in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon to her Oscar-winning performance in Everything Everywhere All at Once. Over her storied career, she has consistently pushed boundaries, proving her versatility both on and off the screen, breaking paths as an Asian woman on the global stage. Now, at the age of 62 Michelle has scored coveted global ambassador roles at not one, but two of fashion’s top luxury brands — Balenciaga and Bottega Veneta."Fashion has changed, and it’s not just about dressing younger people," Yeoh says. "You have to find representation across different generations, and I think what I represent is being proud that you are different, that you are older — and there’s nothing wrong with that. Just before the Oscars a silly television commentator said, ‘You’re past your prime because you’re 50-something.’ How dare you? How dare anybody tell you what you are capable of?”This week on The BoF Podcast, BoF founder and editor-in-chief Imran Amed sits down with Yeoh to discuss her winding journey to the big screen and why fashion is finally embracing older women.Key Insights:  Yeoh’s path to stardom began with her early passion for dance, which she began as a child in Malaysia before travelling to England to study further. When she had to set her dance dreams aside due to injury, the shift opened the door to acting in action and martial arts films alongside actors like Jackie Chan, Sammo Hung and Jet Li. “I watched [Hung] do the choreography and the fighting, and I thought, ‘this is exactly like dance,’” she says. “This is choreography. We all know what we are doing, it's about how you transfer the energy and the speed of the rhythm.”On success and failures, Yeoh embraces the lows moment as opportunities to transform. “Failures are what make you learn. If you're only successful, how do you know that's the way? ... It's the journey, not just the destination," says Yeoh. "And in that journey, that's where you learn. That's where you grow, where you meet, where you engage, and that's where you have a full life.”Yeoh places a deep emphasis on trust and collaboration when choosing her creative partners. “Once I choose to work with you, then I have to trust you. I have to believe that you have the right vision,” she shares. “If I don’t trust you, then I don’t think I’ll be able to give you my best. I have to believe in your vision, that you know what you’re doing, and that we’re in this together."Additional Resources:How Michelle Yeoh Conquered Fashion | BoF 

The beauty industry thrives on virality, but in the age of social media, that can be a double-edged sword. One viral TikTok video can catapult a brand to success — or bring it to its knees. From Youthforia’s foundation shade controversy to Huda Beauty’s mislabeling error, brands are discovering that managing customer expectations and addressing backlash swiftly is critical to their survival.“It happens pretty fast when it does happen. … Sometimes it’s an unknown creator who can make [a product] go viral for all the wrong reasons,” says beauty correspondent Daniela Morosini. “You have to be willing to listen when they tell you that you got it wrong.”Key InsightsBuilding a strong brand community involves more than just creating a product; it means engaging with your customers and allowing them to have a meaningful role in your brand’s development. “If you're going to create a community to help your brand grow, you need to understand that those customers want a seat at the table,” says Morosini. Listening to customer feedback, especially when things go wrong, is crucial. Being proactive in addressing customer complaints is crucial. As demonstrated by Huda Beauty’s mislabeling issue, taking responsibility early on and offering solutions can stop a backlash from spiralling. Morosini notes, “She took full accountability and offered to make everybody whole if they’d bought the wrong shade.”Hair care products, especially those tied to hair loss, tend to evoke emotional responses and intense scrutiny. The stakes are high as hair loss is a sensitive, deeply personal issue. As Morosini points out, “There are so many factors that can cause hair loss… people don't want to roll the dice if there's even a 1% chance a product could be the cause.”Complexion product mishaps can be particularly damaging for beauty brands, as they quickly highlight inclusivity gaps. “It’s just so obvious when a brand has missed the mark with complexion,” says Morosini. “Oftentimes the scandals that seem to cause a lot of blowback, they come back to that exclusionary point,” she adds. “Nobody likes to feel left out.”Additional Resources:What to Do When a Beauty Product Launch Goes Wrong | BoFWhy Beauty Brands Keep Getting Accused of Causing Hair Loss — and What They Can Do About It -Editor's Note: This podcast was amended on Oct. 17 2024 to clarify YSL as the maker of the blush product.

Zac Posen burst onto the fashion scene in the early 2000s, gaining acclaim for his glamorous designs and dressing Hollywood's elite. After nearly two decades, Posen closed his label in 2019, finding himself at a crossroads that eventually led to a meeting with Richard Dickson, the new CEO of Gap Inc., and the chance to join the company as creative director. Now, he's on a mission to bring cultural relevance and excitement back to brands like Gap, Old Navy, Banana Republic, and Athleta.“Within five minutes [of meeting Dickson], I knew that there was something very special. It was a cosmic moment where there was like a magic connection, where I saw that I had met my dreamer,” Posen says.This week on The BoF Podcast, BoF founder and editor-in-chief Imran Amed sits down with Posen to explore his journey of redefining success, his transformative role at Gap Inc., and his vision for the future of fashion.Key InsightsClosing his eponymous fashion label forced Posen to reevaluate how he defined success, shifting his focus from external achievements to personal fulfilment and creative expression. "Success for me is about being able to inspire a larger public, to be able to work within my own creativity and to use that and what I represent to help a larger public be in touch with their own creativity” he says. “To me, creativity is as essential as sleeping and eating and everything else wonderful in life."  Posen found new creative inspiration through returning to his roots of draping and garment creation. “I was back on a mannequin … and just expressing and sculpting in space, it felt exciting,” he shares, describing the joy of reconnecting with hands-on creative work in his father’s studio, the same place where his journey in fashion began. “It felt like a full circle moment.”As creative director of Gap. Inc, Posen is working to modernise brands like Old Navy and Gap by emphasising storytelling, redefining brand identities, and making subtle evolutions that reignite consumer interest. "Building a brand is about being part of the cultural conversation and moving at the speed of culture and actually being able to help move culture forward,” he says.Posen advises young designers to be patient, embrace the balance between art and commerce, and appreciate the opportunity to inspire others. “Creativity is a lifelong pursuit … You can't foresee the path and where it will take you,” he says. “If you are able to work in this industry, to be able to work in a creative field and … understand that fabulous, amazing, magical pendulum that has to be in balance, you are so lucky and so fortunate.”Additional Resources:The Gap Comeback That’s Actually Working | BoF Do Mass Brands Need Creative Directors? | BoFCreating Cultural Moments in the Age of Algorithms | BoF

The influencer landscape has shifted dramatically over the last decade. While the image of influencers posting flawless selfies on exotic, brand-sponsored trips still resonates, the reality has become far more complex. Influencers now host live shoppable streams, publish newsletters on Substack and engage in intimate group chats. Their goal is not just to build a following and wait for brands to come calling, but to establish multiple sources of income through affiliate links, brand deals, and subscription models.“Influencers and creators have realised that they need to diversify and be on multiple platforms. They need to be connecting with their followers in multiple ways and have a deeper relationship with their followers,” says Diana Pearl, senior news and features editor.  “Even five years ago, there were people who didn't really take this industry very seriously and didn't realise the difference they could make for their brand. Now it is impossible to ignore.”Key Insights:In the evolving digital landscape, influencers and creators are no longer relying on a single platform for success. Diversifying their presence across platforms, from Instagram to Substack, is key. Pearl emphasises, “It’s really all just about diversification... not relying so much on one source, not having to rely so much on Instagram, the algorithm, affiliate links and brand deals.”While macro-influencers may reach a broader audience, smaller influencers often have more engaged, loyal followers. “Once you get so big and you've got millions and millions of followers, you can't have that type of relationship with 5 million people the way you can with 100,000,” says Pearl.The rivalry between influencer marketing platforms LTK and ShopMy highlights a shift in the landscape, with ShopMy offering influencers more control and transparency. Pearl explains that while LTK encourages creators to centralise their content on its app, ShopMy allows influencers to share across platforms. “We know our audience, we know what content resonates with them. But if you hand us this really detailed brief and expect us to act like a traditional ad agency... it’s just not going to come off as authentic,” Pearl explains.The industry is becoming more nuanced, with clear distinctions emerging between influencers and creators. While creators focus on producing unique, engaging content, influencers drive sales and hold sway over purchasing decisions. Influence remains the key asset in the industry, one that can be translated across platforms like Instagram, TikTok, or Substack. "At the end of the day, the most valuable commodity in this business is influence," Pearl explains.By understanding their goals and selecting the right partner to meet them, brands can optimise the impact of their influencer campaigns and better connect with their target audiences. “Brands just need to be smart about what are your goals, what’s the right type of person to achieve these goals or right type of partner and who should we go with from there?” says Pearl. Additional Resources:The Widening Gap Between Influencers and CreatorsThe Fight for Influencer Marketing Dollars Heats UpWhat’s Driving the Influencer Subscription Boom