Share

cover art for 151: What Al Gore Misses

This Sustainable Life

151: What Al Gore Misses

Ep. 151

I confess I haven't interacted directly with Al Gore so I don't know how he leads in person. I saw him on stage once, but the person interviewing him, Jaden Smith, was 20 years old and I didn't see grasped the situation. Jaden is Will Smith's son and promotes a bottled water brand---that is, he sells something nearly free with extraneous packaging, which I consider needlessly polluting. My main interaction with Al Gore is through his movies and reading about him in the media.

I would love to have him as a guest. I would love to hear him share his history and the history of the movement from his view. He's won a Nobel Prize, multiple Oscars, and more. I could learn incomparably more from him than he could from me. So when I suggest he's missing something, I mean that in the context of his getting much more. But he's not perfect or omniscient.

I love what he's done to reach where we have, but reaching the next step is going to require leaders who live consistently with the values they recommend to others. People look for any excuse they find to say, "He's doing it" or "She's doing it, so I can too."

If you put in front of someone trying to quit smoking a lit cigarette, no matter how much people are determined to stop, they at least feel motivated to smoke. Given enough time, many will smoke. And when they do, they will think something justifying the behavior, saying in the moment why it's the right thing to do, because emotions drive reason more than reason drives emotion, however much people fantasize otherwise.

Now add to the person sitting there, multiple industries spending trillions to advertise, government subsidies meaning that I'm helping pay for it even though I don't want to, those industries paying people to figure out how to hide the problems, influence the smokers through sophisticate marketing techniques.

Now throw in a surgeon general who smokes, who makes movies showing himself or herself smoking, telling people the dangers of smoking while smoking, telling others not to smoke. And the family doctor smokes. And the nurse. Everyone telling you not to smoke smokes.

The same would happen to someone trying to quit eating too much salt, sugar, fat with putting a gooey chocolate lava cake and an obese surgeon general eating bags of Doritos, family doctors drinking soda while telling people not to eat salt, sugar, and fat.

Or an alcoholic trying to stop drinking with a surgeon general holding a bottle of rum, a family doctor with a six pack of beer, and so on.

This addictive behavior and the self-serving justification people feel before doing it sadly closely describes people's environmental behavior. In my experience, when given the choice between comfort and convenience that pollutes or challenging themselves to avoid polluting, people will use any excuse to continue the comfort and convenience. Two days ago I attended a symposium at NYU on sustainability. The last several talks talked about the problems with single use containers and plastic. As soon as it ended, they all drank wine in disposable plastic cups. I didn't see anyone show any concern.

People are missing the joy and emotional reward of living by their values, which increases with the challenge of doing it. It's like your team coming from behind to win. The greater the deficit, the greater you celebrate the win.

Carbon offsets are a nice fantasy, but they don't remove greenhouse gases from the atmosphere or ocean. They limit the rate of increase, which is not decreasing. The way they motivate people, their net systemic contribution is probably to lead people to pollute more overall.

My model of leadership is to help people do what they want to but haven't figured out how. It's not about convincing, seeking compliance, or coercion. It means helping them identify their values and goals, then to help them achieve them, consistent with the leader's vision.

To motivate people to change their behavior, a leader must practice the behavior he or she recommends---at least not to violate it. Until they do in the area of the environment---if you ask anyone to do what looks like a sacrifice and they think you aren't doing it, their greatest contribution may be to create votes for populists. The irony and one of the biggest experiences I'm trying to share through this podcast is that when it clicks, acting by your values isn't sacrifice. It's the opposite. For that matter, it takes less time to click and register as joy, fun, and other ways rewarding with each practice adopted.

The crazy missing point is that living by their values would improve their lives and effectiveness, at least by my experience. People who say one thing and do another think they're changing the system but are supporting it, comparable to a doctor or surgeon general who smokes or drinks soda. Stopping living by the system's values of growth and externalizing costs and living by and promoting ones like enjoying what you have and taking responsibility for how your behavior affects others will make them more effective and happier.

Not saying saint or perfect. Saint implies morality. Not good, bad, right, wrong but practical matter of helping people live by their values. He has plenty of followers who share his values. I think nearly everyone. Perfect, well no one is. I'm not. You don't have to be. You need only show you're doing your best.

As for all other listeners, pointing at leaders not living by their values doesn't make you abandoning yours any less a personal abandonment. I should say that in the positive. The sooner you face and overcome what inhibitions and challenges stand between you and living by your values, the sooner you'll find greater meaning, purpose, value, passion, growth, and all the things I know you value more than the comfort, convenience, or whatever you get from your equivalent of smoking, eating junk, drinking.

You can lead. Do you have kids? Coworkers? Neighbors? You can lead.

Back to Al Gore, I'm not him and I don't know his community, so I could be wrong, but I see someone with a lot of behaviors inconsistent with the future he describes. He and his supporters may say, yes he causes a lot of emissions, but each use is justified.

They miss two big things.

One, people will follow his behavior. SUV example.

Two, they're missing what he could do more effectively. Instead of going places in person, it looks to me like he could empower more people to do his role. To franchise what he does. Maybe he's doing so as much as he can. If so, I would think he should publicize how much he's polluting and clearly demonstrating how any lower emissions of his would increase emissions globally. If he can't show that, I think that his next great step will be to live by the values he promotes and still be as effective. I am confident he could. When he does, I predict he'll wish he did earlier.

If I'm not presuming too much, I believe being on my podcast would help him.

More episodes

View all episodes

  • 847. 847: Tzeporah Berman: Ending Fossil Fuels by Treaty

    47:42||Ep. 847
    I met Tzeporah at an event called Climate Week NYC last fall. She was nearly the only person there who spoke about decreasing and stopping extracting fossil fuels. I had to bring her here.Our conversation grew more compelling and interesting as we spoke. The early parts about energy sources besides fossil fuels you may have heard before, but give context.After she shares the realizations that prompted her to lead are what I valued. In particular, she exposes and clarifies how people have simply ignored fossil fuel production or extraction in favor of accounting methods and seeing if they can offset things but not decreasing extraction.She also talked about her strategy, which differs from Paris Agreement approaches and is based on how treaties on land mines and chemical weapons succeeded. She also shares some eye-popping statistics, like how much fossil fuels are used just to transport other fossil fuels, which is just over two-thirds.The bottom line is almost too simple to say, but it bears repeating: we have to stop extracting fossil fuels fast. Tzeporah is one of the few working on, undistracted by things that don't stop us from extracting them.The Fossil Fuel Treaty InitiativeHer TED talk: The bad math of the fossil fuel industryHer book: This Crazy Time: Living Our Environmental ChallengeHer Wikipedia page
  • 846. 846: Gail Eisnitz: The Inside Story of a Life Investigating Factory Farms

    01:00:13||Ep. 846
    Gail shares her investigations into meat industry practices, exploring how exorbitant slaughterhouse production line speeds in a consolidated slaughter industry affect animals as they are being handled and killed, and how the proliferation of massive factory farms impacts animals being raised in intensive confinement.She spent decades in the field documenting violations against farm animals and in the office preparing cases and writing about her investigations in articles and books. Her efforts to expose and prosecute animal abusers were often thwarted by network television producers and by law enforcement authorities. Producers considered her findings too disturbing. The law refused to prosecute abusers. Instead they provided cover for the meat industry---a billion-dollar industry.She gives an inside view behind the closed doors of U.S. slaughterhouses and factory farms. She also shared her challenges and successes in documenting and exposing the findings.As a memoir, Out of Sight has been described by reviewers as a “detective story” and a “page turner” that they “can’t put down," probably for her personal challenges related to her diagnosis with a rare medical visual condition she shares in our conversation.Gail's web pageThe Humane Farming AssociationHer most recent book: Out of Sight An Undercover Investigator's Fight for Animal Rights and Her Own SurvivalHer first book: Slaughterhouse The Shocking Story of Greed, Neglect, and Inhumane Treatment Inside the U.S. Meat Industry
  • 845. 845: Sarah Goodyear and Doug Gordon: The War on Cars and Life After Cars

    01:26:50||Ep. 845
    Doug and Sarah's podcastThe War on Cars is a podcast that delivers news and commentary on the latest developments in the worldwide fight to undo a century’s worth of damage wrought by the automobile, approaching the topic from all angles, from politics to pop culture. They release two regular episodes and one Patreon bonus episode per month.Doug and Sarah's BookCars ruin everything. That’s why we need Life After Cars.When the very first cars rolled off production lines, they were a technological marvel, predicted to make life easier and better for everyone; yet a hundred years later, that dream is running on empty.Instead of unbounded freedom, the never-ending proliferation of automobiles has delivered a host of costs, among them the demolition of our neighborhoods, towns, and cities to make way for car infrastructure; an epidemic of violent death; countless hours lost in traffic; isolation from our fellow human beings; and the ongoing destruction of the natural world.That’s why we need Life After Cars. Through historical records, revealing interviews, and unflinching statistics, Sarah Goodyear and Doug Gordon, hosts of the podcast The War on Cars, and former host Aaron Naparstek unpack the scale of damage that cars cause, the forces that have created our current crisis and are invested in perpetuating it, and the way that the fight for better transportation is deeply linked to the fight for a more equitable and just society.Life After Cars expands on the podcast with new interviews and original content—offering something for everyone, from longtime listeners familiar with the harms of car culture to those just beginning to imagine a world with fewer metal boxes zooming around.Cars as we know them today are unsustainable—but there is hope. Life After Cars will arm readers with the tools they need to implement real, transformative change, from simply raising awareness to taking a stand at public forums.It’s past time to radically rethink—and shrink—society’s collective relationship with the automobile.The podcast: The War on CarsThe book: Life After Cars
  • 844. 844: Maya Lilly, part 1: Effective Storytelling and Producing The Years Project

    01:35:59||Ep. 844
    Since I've seen Maya's work on the Years Project with people like executive producers James Cameron and Arnold Schwarzenegger, I was worried I might feel starstruck.Oh wait, she also worked with series creators Joel Bach and David Gelber (of 60 Minutes); chief science advisors podcast guest Joseph Romm and Heidi Cullen; and episode hosts including Cameron, Schwarzenegger, Harrison Ford, Ian Somerhalder, America Ferrera, David Letterman, Gisele Bündchen, Jack Black, Matt Damon, Jessica Alba, Sigourney Weaver.Oh, and the series won an Emmy for Outstanding Documentary or Nonfiction Series.She was engaging, informative, open, and fun. We laughed a bunch We talked about her passion for the art and practice of storytelling. You have to be true to the science, but you can't skimp on the story or take for granted it will work. We also talked about her background that brought her to this level.The Years ProjectIts YouTube pageMaya's curated climate listUPDATE: After we recorded, Maya noted that about halfway in, she said "Bread and Puppet theatre in San Francisco." The actual troop was The San Francisco Mime Troupe.
  • 843. 843: Judith Enck, part 2: The Problem with Plastic (the Book)

    28:43||Ep. 843
    Judith just published The Problem with Plastic: How We Can Save Ourselves and Our Planet Before It’s Too Late.I've read a lot about plastic and hosted many authors. I won't lie. Before starting the book, I thought I should read it because I knew her, but didn't expect much.Instead, I learned a lot new. I found it engaging and compelling. I recommend it.Yes, you'll learn things that are sobering, but you'd rather know than not know, especially things that affect your health and safety and your family's. It also guides you to how to respond, personally, socially, and politically. Judith cares and has experience.Start by listening to our conversation. Then read the book.The Problem with Plastic: How We Can Save Ourselves and Our Planet Before It’s Too LateWEBINAR with co-authors Judith Enck, Adam Mahoney, and Melissa Valliant, January 28, 2026
  • 842. 842: Silvia Bellezza, part 1.5 and 2: When at first you don't succeed

    39:44||Ep. 842
    Since Silvia teaches as a business school, I'll address a leadership aspect of our interaction. I skimped on a leadership step, so we did an episode 1.5, which is my lingo for redoing episode 1 when the person wasn't able to fulfill his or her commitment. That's my responsibility as leader of the interaction.Silvia and I had a wonderful first conversation that led to a commitment that sounded like she'd enjoy it and doable, but in the end wasn't quite. Even if a quick hike north of the city would be enjoyable, catching a Metro-North train from Columbia University isn't that convenient and her schedule may not have bee as flexible as she suspected in our first conversation.For those listening to these conversations to learn the Spodek Method, in our first conversation I didn't check with her how practical the commitment was given her constraints. As the leader of the interaction, I should have asked ahead to imagine her schedule, the logistics of catching the train, and so on. The key measure the first time someone acts on their intrinsic motivation isn't how big it is. It's if they person does it.When someone acts on intrinsic motivation, they'll find it rewarding. If they feel reward, they'll want to do it again and the next time will be bigger, especially if they've always considered acting on sustainability a sacrifice or something that has to be big or any of the other myths people propagate. Sadly, even ardent environmentalists lead people to think of acting more sustainably as something they won't like or won't find rewarding when they use tactics like trying to convince, cajole, coerce, or seek compliance.In this double episode we hear how she did something more practical. At the end, note that she's open to doing more.
  • 841. 841: Sandra Goldmark, part 1: Fixation: How to Have Stuff without Breaking the Planet

    41:57||Ep. 841
    How often does something break that you know could be fixed, but you don't know how and there are no places to fix it? I remember repair stores all over the place, but the field doesn't exist any more. We all know about planned obsolescence and how products are designed to break. Now we feel we have to throw things away and replace them (after avoiding buying things when possible, which is far more than most of us practice).Enter Sandra Goldmark, as a member of a growing movement to fix things and make things fixable. She's also an Ivy League professor at Barnard and the Columbia Climate School, so, no, professors don't have to be out of touch.I met Sandra before the pandemic, at a shop she set up down by the South Street Seaport to repair things. Besides her own book Fixation, she was mentioned in a book (The Repair Revolution) in my sustainability leadership workshop alumni book club.Lest you think people have to be born fixers or educated as engineers, a preconception that I find still holds me back, she shares her background not growing up with those things. On the contrary, she found she enjoyed it and found community.Listen for a basic human approach to fixing things and changing culture.Sandra's home pageHer book, FixationHer page at Barnard
  • 840. 840: Dr. Leonardo Trasande, part 1: Sicker, Fatter, Poorer: The Urgent Threat of Hormone-Disrupting Chemicals to Our Health and Future ... and What We Can Do About It

    01:10:11||Ep. 840
    I found Dr. Trasande quoted in a Washington Post article The health risks from plastics almost nobody knows about: Phthalates, chemicals found in plastics, are linked to an array of problems, especially in pregnancy. He said, "Endocrine-disrupting chemicals are one of the biggest global health threats of our time ... And 2 percent of us know about it---but 99 percent of us are affected by it.”The article said that he said that "at the population level, scientists can see telltale signs that those chemicals are undermining human health, adding to growing male infertility or growing cases of ADHD." This outcome suggests a violation of this nation being founded on protecting life, liberty, and property, and the consent of the governed. I also found from this video, Food Contaminants and Additives, that he reported his results thoroughly, taking care not to venture outside his research.I had to talk to him.We talked about his research, what brought him to a new field, now burgeoning, of learning about chemicals that disrupt our endocrine systems---that is, they mess with our hormones. You'll hear that he didn't intend to go into it. It was (tragically) growing in importance since our hormone systems are becoming increasingly disrupted, as are those of many species.I should be more accurate. They aren't passively being disrupted. Consumers are paying companies to produce chemicals that do it.It sounds slimy and scary. I'd rather it didn't happen, but since it does, I'd rather know than not know. I think you would too.Dr. Trasande's NYU faculty page
  • 839. 839: Saabira Chaudhuri: Consumed: Throwaway Plastic Has Corrupted Us

    48:34||Ep. 839
    Reading Saabira's New York Times piece Throwaway Plastic Has Corrupted Us told me she saw more about plastic and its effect on our culture than most. A quote from it: "The social costs of our addiction to disposable plastics are more subtle but significant. Cooking skills have declined. Sit-down family meals are less common. Fast fashion, enabled by synthetic plastic fibers, is encouraging compulsive consumption and waste."Her tenure at the Wall Street Journal told me she would communicate it effectively, pulling no punches. As much as I prefer not to link to social media, this video review by Chris van Tulleken, bestselling author of Ultra-Processed People, is about as positive a review as I've seen, all the more since he clarifies that he doesn't know her.So I invited her to talk about her book Consumed: How Big Brands Got Us Hooked on Plastic. It launches today (October 7) in the US, so I've only finished the beginning, but it delivers. In our conversation, she describes what to expect when you read it, plus her back story driving her to write it.Many reviews describe her humor. You'll hear that I held back from asking her about how she worked humor into the topic, since she's not a comedian so I wouldn't expect to perform unprepared, but no worry, she made me laugh unprompted and shared more humor from the book. Obviously it's a serious topic, and Saabira's work shows how much more serious than you probably thought, but being depressed doesn't help solve it.Saabira's home pageHer New York Times piece that brought me to her: Throwaway Plastic Has Corrupted UsHer book page for ConsumedThe video review we mention by Chris van Tulleken, bestselling author of Ultra-Processed People