Analyze Scripts

Welcome back to Analyze Scripts, where a psychiatrist and a therapist analyze what Hollywood gets right and wrong about mental health. Today, we are kicking off 2024 with Disney's 2013 smash hit "Frozen." This film has taken the world by (ice) storm, and we'd argue for good reason! In this episode, we spend time discussing perfectionism and "eldest daughter syndrome" while analyzing Anna and Elsa's sibling dynamic and their different reactions to early childhood trauma. It's so fascinating and fun to use these characters to explore anxious-avoidant attachment (Elsa) and disinhibited social engagement disorder (Anna). We also (once again!) discuss a character with nefarious intent and ASPD (antisocial personality disorder) traits - Hans! We talk about why people like Anna are more vulnearble to sociopathic manipulation and exploitation, and how you can protect yourself if you find yourself interacting with people like this. We are so stoked Disney depicted such complex themes for a new generation and we hope you enjoy!

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[00:10] Dr. Katrina Furey: Hi, I'm Dr. Katrina Furey, a psychiatrist.

[00:12] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: And I'm Portia Pendleton, a licensed clinical social worker. And this is analyze scripts, a podcast where two shrinks analyze the depiction of.

[00:21] Dr. Katrina Furey: Mental health in movies and tv shows.

[00:23] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Our hope is that you learn some legit info about mental health while feeling like you're chatting with your girlfriends.

[00:28] Dr. Katrina Furey: There is so much misinformation out there, and it drives us nuts.

[00:32] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: And if someday we pay off our student loans or land a sponsorship, like.

[00:36] Dr. Katrina Furey: With a lay flat airline or a.

[00:37] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Major beauty brand, even better. So sit back, relax, grab some popcorn.

[00:42] Dr. Katrina Furey: And your dsm five, and enjoy. Let it go. Let it go. We're so excited to talk about Frozen today. If you couldn't tell, that was not Adina Menzel. That was me.

[01:05] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Wow.

[01:07] Dr. Katrina Furey: I know she's basically my doppelganger when it comes to singing, but I know it's quite a shock.

[01:13] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: But.

[01:14] Dr. Katrina Furey: No, in all seriousness, I'm really excited to talk about Frozen. It's January when this is being released. It's very chilly in the northeast where we live, and it's just such a classic movie. I believe it's like the ten year anniversary of it being released, right?

[01:32] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah.

[01:33] Dr. Katrina Furey: And obviously there's been a sequel, and there's going to be a third one coming out, I think, in a year or two. I can't remember if it's 2024 or 2025, but there's definitely a third one coming out. So if you've been living under a rock, this 2013 mega hit Frozen is a Disney movie inspired by Hans Christian Anderson's fairy tale the Snow Queen. Again, I just love using fairy tales to talk about mental health stuff and development and attachment and all the things. And it won, like, a bazillion award. It won an Oscar for best animated feature, best original song, which, you know, gave you a little preview of. It won a Golden Globe. It won a BAFTA award. It won two Grammy awards. I mean, just huge. And have you seen this before, Portia?

[02:22] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yes, I have. And I do really like it. Yeah. I really like frozen. The music is wonderful.

[02:27] Dr. Katrina Furey: I do, too.

[02:28] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah.

[02:29] Dr. Katrina Furey: So good. It's so good. The music is right on par for me with Encanto, where I don't mind listening to it. It really gets in your head. And I know I keep talking about my recent Disney trip, but it's just because it was so much fun, and there's just so much, like, frozen paraphernalia everywhere.

[02:51] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Oh, yeah.

[02:52] Dr. Katrina Furey: And it's great, right? Because everyone loves frozen, I think, also because it was, like, the Christmas time. So it was easy to incorporate. But, like, at Hollywood studios, they have a whole frozen sing along, which is great. There's some characters, and then there's some funny narrators, and then you get to sing some of the songs with the kids, and Elsa comes out, and all the little kids go crazy. You can meet Olaf, and it's just, like, adorable. And I just think one thing I love about this movie is it's just so different from the classic Disney movies where it's not like the girl finding her true love in a male partner. It's like the sisters and their love between each other is, like, what saves the day. It's so beautiful.

[03:45] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: I didn't watch it, I think, for, like, a year or two. But it's so funny because I was like, oh, at the end, her sister saves her, not the guy. And I was like, oh, I wish that her sister could save her. So, obviously, that memory had stayed with me, but I don't know why I thought it was, like, my idea or I had this epiphany that, oh, it could be, like, family love or friend love, but obviously, Disney knew what they were doing, and I love that twist to it. I think it's, like, such a difference from the traditional Disney princess movies.

[04:20] Dr. Katrina Furey: Right. And it's like one of those messages that, like, so glad children are seeing and internalizing these days. So I wanted to start, if it's okay if I take the lead, um, just talking, know, once again, their early childhood attachment styles.

[04:39] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: I know.

[04:40] Dr. Katrina Furey: Total shocker that we want to analyze the attachment styles of Elsa and Anna.

[04:45] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Right.

[04:46] Dr. Katrina Furey: Did that cross your mind at all?

[04:48] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah, it crossed my mind with Anna, with. And you're going to talk more about the types, but her disinhibited social. Right. She'll go with anyone.

[04:58] Dr. Katrina Furey: Oh, my Gosh.

[04:58] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: You guys are the best, or I'm in love with you. And they just.

[05:01] Dr. Katrina Furey: Yes, yes, exactly. So, again, we see. Okay, so Elsa is older than Anna. We don't exactly know how much older, but I think, like, nicely displays, like, eldest daughter syndrome, which is not a real syndrome, but funnily enough, have you been seeing that thing floating around on Instagram? I love it. It's like, we do need to add it to the. It's just so funny. But anyway, we kind of saw that again with Kanto, with just. It's funny. So Elsa is a little older than Anna, but they're still pretty close in age enough to be, like, playmates and stuff. And we see early on that as they're playing Elsa has these powers that she doesn't know how to control, and it hurts Anna. And so, very early on, we see her parents take them to the trolls, which are really cute. I guess they're almost like the medicine men of Arendelle, who give them the advice, know, in order to heal Anna, they have to remove that part of her memory. And interestingly, it leaves that wisp of white hair. So there's always, like, a trace of it, right? It's always a trace of the trauma, even if you can't remember.

[06:12] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: It's a good metaphor.

[06:14] Dr. Katrina Furey: Yes, for repression, right? But then she forgets that bond with her sister, and then it's almost like the parents lock Elsa away from everyone because she can't control her powers. And I always just thought that was so interesting and so sad. And, gosh, really sends the message to Elsa that you hurt people you can't control. Right. Like, how did you interpret that?

[06:49] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: I loved watching it, knowing that we were going to record, because I felt like I thought about it in such a different way. And with her, it was just like, exactly what you're saying with repression. But it's like, Elsa has to be so perfect and feel nothing, like a shell, which we're not wired to be, in order to not have any emotion, which will then kind of send the ice and snow all over the place. And so I think that's often, like, a message that some people get. You can't be yourself or your emotions are too big, and so then we tuck that all away, and then what happens? We explode.

[07:24] Dr. Katrina Furey: Right, exactly. And also. Great. I just was thinking, like, I wonder if Elsa struggled with disordered eating and perfectionism. Maybe OCD.

[07:35] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Again, we don't profile with those kind of disorders.

[07:40] Dr. Katrina Furey: Right. She's at risk for those things. And even with wearing her gloves to prevent the ice, I could just see some OCD type behavior she could develop. We don't see that in the movie, but, again, being super analytical. But, yeah, just, like, even if you just use the ice as a metaphor for emotion. Oh, it's beautifully done. It is, right? It's so beautifully. So, like, basically, Elsa's emotions trigger the ice, which hurts her sister. And I think all siblings can relate to this, that sometimes they hurt your siblings. There's conflict. But, like, gosh, it must have been so hard for Elsa to be so locked away and so scared and to be trying to control it but not being able to yet. And it's like, girl, she just got to just let her grow up.

[08:33] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: And the blame. Right.

[08:34] Dr. Katrina Furey: The self blame the shame. Really intense. And then we have Anna, like, on the other end.

[08:41] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yes.

[08:42] Dr. Katrina Furey: Who's also isolated but in a different way.

[08:45] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Right. She doesn't know. Right. Like, she doesn't know why. It's just, like, everyone's treating us this way. That's just how it is. No one's explained it.

[08:55] Dr. Katrina Furey: You don't get the sense, like. So they weren't let out of the castle either. Like, the doors were shut. They're all in.

[09:01] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: The windows were shut. It's dark. It's, like, empty.

[09:04] Dr. Katrina Furey: It's cold.

[09:05] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Which I just think is whole movie's way of talking about isolation.

[09:10] Dr. Katrina Furey: Yes. What that feels like. And so then even you have Anna. I'm like, did they each have a separate tutor? They don't have any friend. Did Anna at least get to talk to the staff? She at least would talk to the. Like, she could at least use some make believe or. But, like, she was also isolated but not alone in a room. She was, like, in a big old castle. But I got the sense she had more interactions with her parents or stuff. Like. But, like, not enough, I think, to develop secure attachment style.

[09:44] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Definitely felt neglectful after Elsa had hurt her. And then when the parents.

[09:52] Dr. Katrina Furey: Oh, the parents always have to die in Disney movies. And at that little show I was just talking about, the frozen sing along at Disney. That's one of the funny things they mentioned. They list off all, really, movies where the parents died. It takes him, like, ten minutes, all of them. Right. And I was trying to figure out how old were they when the parents died? It seemed like at least adolescence or young adulthood. But it's tragic. It's unexpected. It's in a shipwreck. It's really sad. So they barely had any social connection. Their parents were like, it, and now they're gone, and now they have to figure out what to do. Right.

[10:41] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: And I'm wondering if the parents had been alive, still would know, and maybe any parents. No one gets it perfect, but I wonder if they would have helped Anna or, I'm sorry, Elsa later on with maybe taking her to the trolls again when she's an adult helping her. But it's like, regard will never. So, like, she didn't get any help in kind of trying to regulate her emotions. So first the message was right. Like, I'm bad. I hurt people. There's something wrong with me. But then the loss of the parents, which was obviously wildly impactful, but then there was no opportunity for her to receive a different, like, she.

[11:22] Dr. Katrina Furey: It's like, just, like, compounded psychological isolation and alienation. Right, yeah. And then we see how each girl, Elsa and Anna reacts to then interacting with society, and they take such wildly different approaches. Right. So do you want to speak to that a little bit?

[11:45] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah, I thought. And again, the music is just so wonderful. I loved the whole song. When Anna is watching them open up the castle, right? She's running around, she's seeing the light. She's going through the gates. She's, like, dancing around everyone. She's so excited to finally get her needs met and be around a million people and talk to everyone and look at everyone, and then obviously, like, polar opposite. Elsa is so terrified of what she might do, what might happen. It's visible, which I think is great for kids. Like, Anna's like. And then Elsa's just, like, there with her gloves so tight, like, her chest, her body language.

[12:27] Dr. Katrina Furey: Right. Just trying so hard to not feel anything, but actually feeling a ton of.

[12:32] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah, yeah. And I forgot that the guy who Anna meets was bad Hans. Yeah. Oh, my God.

[12:43] Dr. Katrina Furey: Again, not to go back to that little show, but it was so funny in that little show at, like, they run through the plot and everything, and they put Hans up on the big screen, and the man narrator was like, he's literally wearing a red flag because he wears, like, a red. Oh, my God. I thought that was so funny.

[13:02] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: And I was like, yes, that's hilarious.

[13:05] Dr. Katrina Furey: He's such a good example of love bombing, right?

[13:11] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah. Like, a perfect example.

[13:13] Dr. Katrina Furey: Perfect example of just, like, again, when we say love bombing, that's not, like, a technical term. Like, we don't use that diagnostically. It's not in the DSM. But it's, like, this way of interacting that people often with malicious intent, whether they're fallen, the narcissistic spectrum, the antisocial spectrum, or they're just manipulative. This way they relate to you to really suck you in. So love bombing might be really quickly praising you, idealizing you, buying you gifts, flying you on a private jet, proposing you love.

[13:48] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yes.

[13:49] Dr. Katrina Furey: Mirroring back whatever you're interested in, they mirror it back to, like, oh, my God, me? Like, you feel like you've met your twin. Know stuff like that. Such a perfect example. And again, I was stoked that Disney is displaying this, as hopefully, all the children watching are internalizing this as a cautionary tale. Right?

[14:10] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: And Elsa even says, like, you can't.

[14:11] Dr. Katrina Furey: Marry someone you just met, which is.

[14:14] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Totally accurate, like, day of. Right. Like, we shouldn't be doing that. And I think it speaks, know, on polar opposite ends of the spectrum, I think that's an appropriate advice to give. However, it's also Elsa giving that advice who's like, I don't know. She would never want to be with a partner, or that could never happen. And then Anna is so vulnerable to someone taking interest in her and talking to her that it's so easy for her to be swooped up, which people who are malicious often can pick up on.

[14:40] Dr. Katrina Furey: They can sniff it out. Right. I think that's like, you just got to be so careful. And I think if you have a personal. This is not medical advice. I have to give that disclaimer, but I might recommend, if it were, that if you have a personal history of attachment, trauma or neglect or abandonment or abuse, just know that you might be at risk for really craving that love and attention and validation and approval. And people with these traits and malicious intent, they can sniff that out.

[15:18] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Totally.

[15:19] Dr. Katrina Furey: I just think you're more at risk for being exploited or sucked up in that way. I just see this all the time with patients.

[15:30] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Right.

[15:31] Dr. Katrina Furey: Especially I'm thinking of children, adolescents with early childhood trauma, or even certain types of intellectual disabilities or things like that. People who have nefarious intent will prey on vulnerable people whose defenses are lower. That's just like, how it happens, right?

[15:51] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: And I wish there was. I'm curious, the science behind is it the body language that I guess classic, maybe like, I'm thinking narcissist or sociopath is picking up on? How do they know? What are they reading? Is it like, not in my heart body language.

[16:11] Dr. Katrina Furey: But I think also another thing that I read somewhere along the way in my training or readings or whatever, is that people who have a secure inner sense of themselves feel like they are worth being treated with respect and are worth having their own boundaries and know that they can say no or are able to stay in touch with things that don't feel good and know, like, I don't like that I'm going to pivot and move a different direction.

[16:41] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Right.

[16:42] Dr. Katrina Furey: So the person trying to get to you isn't going to get to that person, right. Because they're going to turn away from them. But the person, maybe who doesn't have that secure inner sense of themselves or who struggles to set boundaries because it wasn't modeled for them or their own boundaries were violated in childhood, it's going to have a harder time naturally turning away from them. And I think that's when those people are like, aha, I might be able to get you. So let me lay it on thick and really try to get my claw. Does that make sense? I think that's at least part of it.

[17:19] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: I was just thinking of, like, I don't know if it's him, but I think Ted Bundy really, truly, classically, like a predator out there kind of at a bar or somewhere, and it's like, just kind of scanning the room. And I think somebody has spoken about being surviving because they didn't go with them or something like that. And this is so just not maybe true at all. But I wonder if they had a secure attachment or, like, oh, I don't really want to.

[17:49] Dr. Katrina Furey: They didn't.

[17:50] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Versus noticing someone who's maybe seems really uncomfortable or insecure, kind of looking around and like, okay, that person looks like I can be really nice and make. Yeah.

[18:05] Dr. Katrina Furey: Even as you said that, portia, you sort of hunched. Like, even your own body language as you're describing what you imagine it might look like. I think you're right. And I think these people are really good. I think especially sociopaths or people with antisocial personality disorder when it reaches that level. Like with Ted Bundy, he purposefully feigned illness or injury to lure his victims in. So it's only going to be the people who have a kind enough heart to go help that he's going to get. So already, there's going to be other people who are like, I'm too busy for this, blah, blah, blah, blah. These other people with a kind heart could also be busy, but put someone else's assumed needs ahead of their own and then get sucked in. Right? Yeah, but people with really pure, really nefarious, antisocial personality disorder are experts at mimicking human emotions and behavior without actually feeling any of it. So you've got to imagine they have been studying this in other people in a way that other people aren't. And again, this is just my opinion. This isn't like, I don't have data to back this up, but I think that they're just really astute at picking that up. And I always say, just, like, sniffing out the vulnerability.

[19:28] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Which, again, Elsa was right, or Anna was right in front of him, but there was no way he was going to be approaching Elsa.

[19:36] Dr. Katrina Furey: He might have wanted to, right?

[19:37] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: But she.

[19:41] Dr. Katrina Furey: Wouldn'T even. Again, Elsa's not even out there in the crowds trying to make friends.

[19:47] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Right?

[19:47] Dr. Katrina Furey: Anna's, like, everywhere. And then I bet Hans, when they fall into the boat together, could quickly pick that up, that she's so eager for attachment or friendship, that she has that vulnerability that he's going to use it and exploit know. Yeah, it's a really interesting, he's, you.

[20:07] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Know, the red flag guy. I love that. I wish people could walk around with their red flags because some red flags are just red flags. For some people, it's like, oh, that's not a good thing for me. But other red flags are like, danger, danger, avoid.

[20:22] Dr. Katrina Furey: I think the thing is that people who, again, their early needs are not met or their own boundaries are violated or things like that. People who struggle with their own types of boundaries for whatever reason, whether it's something as severe as early childhood abuse or neglect or it's just like you grew up in kind of a dysfunctional family. I just think when you're vulnerable to this, you're almost, like, good at talking yourself out of your fear response.

[20:51] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yes.

[20:51] Dr. Katrina Furey: And we've talked about this before, too, how in our american culture, women are kind of just, like, conditioned to do. Right?

[21:02] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah, I think we talked about Barbie.

[21:05] Dr. Katrina Furey: With Barbie. We've talked about it with you when she's being stalked.

[21:09] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yes.

[21:10] Dr. Katrina Furey: You talked about a lot how in our society, women just walking around over the course of their life will face sexual harassment, sexual assault, like things like this. And you're just sort of told to like, well, that's boys. All of those messages get internalized. And I think people who maybe fall victim to these situations, again, it's not their fault by any means, but I think someone who can stick with that fear response and internally validate it and listen to it and get out of there is very different from someone who might feel it but then has been conditioned to undo it or minimize it and validate it for themselves. So then they're like, well, I'm probably overreacting, rather than being like, no, this is my gut telling me to get out of here.

[22:02] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah, no, I agree. And I think it's so like Anna was in love with Hans when she meets Christophe. Yes. And so I think it's nice because they got to develop this friendship where, like, did have boundaries, and it was like, friends. And we don't do this. And I'm being more direct with you and I'm kind of being more myself, whereas that, again, within the context of the movie, I think sets, like, a good groundwork for it being safe, even when then they are in love. I'm hopeful about that relationship because it started that way where it was like she throws the carrots right at his head because she buys them this stuff and he's helping her, but she's like, oh, get away. I just think it's good. They're evenly matched then. Because she's in love.

[23:01] Dr. Katrina Furey: Right, exactly, but. And she's not. Like, I could see Anna, like, with Hans. Like, at first it seemed like when they're singing that song together about finishing each other's sandwiches, she's saying things and he's mirroring it back. But I could also see it go the other way where when she feels like, oh, this is it. Yeah, I'm finally in love. Like, I've always wanted to be in love. I could see her kind of, like, changing herself to mirror his interests and needs so she doesn't lose. Like, I think she has attachment trauma and she's going to be afraid of loss. So anyway, then we see. Where do we go to next? I mean, I want to get back to Elsa and how she banishes which.

[23:43] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Which. Which makes sense, such in the context of her greatest fear. So she loses her gloves, and then she loses her emotions, which are normal emotions to have at that time. Like, this is scary. Coronation. Like, all this is pressure. And then she puts up that wall and everyone sees her. And then that mean little man, weasel man, is like, she's a witch or.

[24:08] Dr. Katrina Furey: Yeah, she runs away. Like, who wouldn't run away? Like, so much pressure. She's got no model for how to do this. No one's ever really helped her regulate her own emotions. Elsa needs some good old DBT, but. So she runs away. She's avoidant. And she just, again, is, like, really good depiction, I think, of avoidant attachment style. Right?

[24:30] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah, that way. And it kind of is physically, but it is also for her, too.

[24:38] Dr. Katrina Furey: And I just love in the iconic musical sequence of let it go, how she just. You see her feel so comfortable with just shooting out the ice, building the wall. She takes her hair down. She changes her outfit. Right? You see her just grow into herself. And the lyrics of the song are actually so moving when you think about it, as you could apply it to anyone, maybe especially girls, just being like, shed this image of perfection. Just like, be yourself. And then she's like, the cold never bothered me anyway. It's like, yeah, you can feel all these negative feelings.

[25:22] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: You're a snow queen.

[25:23] Dr. Katrina Furey: You're a human. We all have negative feelings. It's okay. It's just really beautiful. But then you still see how it creates such interpersonal conflict with Anna, who, despite everything, still wants to be her sister and is worried about her and goes after her. Anna's not like, okay, I'll be queen. Right, bye, Elsa. Like, I'll do know which maybe some people, like one of the succession siblings might have know, but she wants to go find her and she loves her. And I think that is that thread of that early connection they had. And again, playing with the snowman back when Elsa had the powers and they were kids and they'd sneak into the ballroom and play with them and it was not dangerous yet. And then I just thought it was really beautiful that then Olaf is this concrete depiction of that bond they have that helps bring them back together.

[26:16] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah. It is a happy ending in the sense that I think of Anna kind of, kind of repeatedly, even throughout childhood, trying to get Elsa to play with her after, like, kind of banished as, like Charlie Brown continuing to kick the football and getting it pulled out over and over and over again and how painful that. But, like, at least in this scenario, it does work out. Her consistent kind of, I'm here. I want to be your friend. I want to be your sibling. I want to be your sister. I want to love you works, but in other ways sometimes not in this movie, but it doesn't. And it just really painful.

[26:55] Dr. Katrina Furey: It just reminded me of totally different vibe. But in the bear season two and the finale, when Richie is outside the freezer or the fridge that Carmen's stuck in and Carmen's just spewing all this hatred and venom vitriol at him and Richie stays constant and is like, I love you, I love you. It's just like that's sort of the same thing. And also is trying to push her away, know, building the ice castle, making that big snowman guy and trying to keep her away. But Anna keeps coming. Again, could it be at her own detriment? Like, she could have gotten really right? Yeah. Again, like, Anna's vulnerable to continuing to seek out people who might be hurting her, but in this way, it has a good ending.

[27:45] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah. Which is why it's worth it. But sometimes it doesn't work out that way.

[27:51] Dr. Katrina Furey: Sometimes it's not worth it. And that's really hard when you're faced with a situation like that, when it is your sibling or it is a family member or something and the hurt that they're giving to you exceeds the love or the connection you're able to share with them. That I think can be when at least with my patients, we start talking about some hard boundaries to set.

[28:17] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah, that's true. I know we talked about it a little bit, but even just like, the grief, I were wondering if the staff could have been there for them. But I mean, man, like, someone needed to step up in that castle, whether it's like, the chef, the nanny, the teacher, just to give them some kind of connection. Because the song that Anna sings when they're opening the gates, it's really sad. It literally sounds like it's dark. Like they never are able to see outside. Like, ever.

[28:52] Dr. Katrina Furey: I was wondering, did she ever feel the ever, like, what is her vitamin D level? How's her bone?

[28:59] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Like, I know.

[29:02] Dr. Katrina Furey: And it's really interesting, right. That even if you look at those lyrics without Kristen Bell singing it in such a animated, happy way, it is pretty sad the first time in.

[29:14] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Right?

[29:15] Dr. Katrina Furey: Whoa.

[29:17] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah.

[29:17] Dr. Katrina Furey: Whoa. But then neither of them is showing, like, a reactive attachment style, which we talked a little bit about in our episode last month about the Grinch. So they had some thread of connection. I do think it's like those early years with their parents playing together. The gates were open. They were out and about. So that did, I think, help set this stage. But then it got disrupted. And I just wonder, will they feel angry toward their parents at some point for keeping them so far to how are they going to bridge that know.

[29:51] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Right. And then we see Kristoff with his enormous family of the trolls. Trolls I know, like, adopt, talking about, which is silly, but, like, embarrassing him in front of Anna about, like, you should date. You guys should be together and why not? And I thought that was, like, a silly, fun part. I also liked that it wasn't that they were trolls and he was in the family. I thought that was just, like, a cute way of showing different versions of families and what that means.

[30:22] Dr. Katrina Furey: Yeah. And that you can be family and not look the same in that. Again, there's such interesting parallels with the Grinch in this. Know, that was just, like, totally cool there. But in the was, he was totally ostracized for looking different.

[30:39] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Right. Yeah. And then there's more trauma with Elsa being arrested and sentenced to death and then Hans telling Elsa that Anna was dead and vice versa. Him leaving Anna to die after she thinks that that's the love of her life.

[30:59] Dr. Katrina Furey: That's what's going to save. Yeah. Yeah. Hello. But that's what people like Hans do. Have we seen you, like. Hello.

[31:08] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah. Literally. Literally being chained in a.

[31:13] Dr. Katrina Furey: That's what. Again, Hans has one goal in mind, and he wants the power at any cost, and that really displays it. Getting back to, like, I did find myself wondering, why is everyone pushing on like, he doesn't have to like her.

[31:30] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah.

[31:30] Dr. Katrina Furey: She wasn't that nice to him at know.

[31:34] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Whatever.

[31:34] Dr. Katrina Furey: It's a Disney movie. Okay. But I was like, why? We don't have to fall in love.

[31:39] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: It's okay.

[31:40] Dr. Katrina Furey: We can just be friends, but. Okay.

[31:43] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah, it seems like maybe. So what made him come back? Was it the donkey?

[31:51] Dr. Katrina Furey: Right?

[31:51] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Like the. Yeah, because she's in love with Hans and happily ever after. Yay. But why does he come back? He finds out what's going. Forget.

[32:01] Dr. Katrina Furey: Well, like, how did he meet Anna?

[32:03] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: No, when they. So, like, he takes her back to Hans or to the castle to be like, hans, save her, like the love of your life, and then he leaves, and then why does he come back to save her? He finds out that she's not being saved or something. I can't remember because I'm wondering if that's the. Like, when does he move? Oh, like, she's. He. She's. He's going to get a new sled, apparently, or she bought this stuff for him. I don't know.

[32:34] Dr. Katrina Furey: I know Christoph took her to the trolls when it started to freeze because Elsa's powers, like, her heart, and that's when the trolls said only an act of true love will save her. So then he's like, okay, I got to get her to Hans. So he takes her and delivers her to Hans, and then that's when Hans also has Elsa and is locking her away and telling them different things. And I think as they're trying to escape, somehow, I feel like, if I remember correctly, Olaf got involved and helped shed light on it somehow. And I think somehow in there, when Elsa escapes, he runs into her, and that's when the plot gets.

[33:19] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Two days ago. And I don't know why I can't remember, but it's just like a switch, right? It's, like, sudden, maybe thinks she's cool, but then all of a sudden, they're in love, right?

[33:29] Dr. Katrina Furey: Yeah. It's Disney. So, again, I'm like, well, it's healthier than. But healthier.

[33:35] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah.

[33:36] Dr. Katrina Furey: And maybe we'll just kind of, like, see where it goes. Have you seen the second one?

[33:39] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: I haven't.

[33:40] Dr. Katrina Furey: Oh, well, maybe we can cover that one next if people like this. Any final thoughts as we wrap up?

[33:47] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: No, I think if you haven't seen the meme kind of going around about the older sister syndrome, I think you should check it out. I think it's hilarious.

[33:55] Dr. Katrina Furey: It's so funny and just speaks to.

[33:57] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Elsa, kind of type a, and just like, all the things that come along with. True. It's so true.

[34:03] Dr. Katrina Furey: Well, thank you so much for listening again to our first episode of the new year. We're excited to kick off our second year podcasting and couldn't think of a better movie to start with. Please rate, review, and subscribe if you're enjoying our content to help us grow, please follow us on Instagram and TikTok at Analyze Scripts podcast we love interacting with people, so if you have any recommendations, we'd love to hear them and you can find us on YouTube as well. I forgot about that.

[34:31] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Yeah.

[34:31] Dr. Katrina Furey: All right, we'll see you next time.

[34:33] Portia Pendleton, LCSW: Bye.

[34:39] Dr. Katrina Furey: This podcast and its contents are a copyright of analyzed scripts. All rights reserved. Any redistribution or reproduction of part or all of the contents in any form is prohibited unless you want to share it with your friends and rate, review, and subscribe. That's fine. All stories and characters discussed are fictional in nature. No identification with actual persons, living or deceased places, buildings, or products is intended or should be inferred. This podcast is for entertainment purposes only. The podcast and its contents do not constitute professional mental health or medical advice. Listeners might consider consulting a mental health provider if they need assistance with any mental health problems or concerns. As always, please call 911 or go directly to your nearest emergency room for any psychiatric emergencies. Thanks for listening and see you next time.