Who Cares Wins with Lily Cole


What Can We Believe? With David Attenborough, Carole Cadwalladr, Alan Rusbridger, Vanessa Nakate, and Rutger Bregman

Season 1, Ep. 5

Building on the conversation from the previous episode, Lily investigates how our public awareness is shaped by the media we consume. Lily speaks with Carole Cadwalladr - the groundbreaking investigative journalist who broke The Facebook–Cambridge Analytica scandal; as well as Alan Rusbridger, the former Guardian editor-in-chief and member of the Facebook Oversight Board. Lily also hears from Ugandan youth climate activist Vanessa Nakate on how she uses social media to draw attention to marginalised voices; and David Attenborough on the importance of television for growing environmental awareness. The episode concludes with a thought provoking conversation with historian and author Rutger Bregman about our negativity bias, and why perhaps, we should simply read less news.

With thanks to the Radio Times for giving permission to use the interview with David Attenborough, and to Hay Festival for their permission to use the interview with Rutger Bregman.

You can find out more about the themes touched on in episode, as well as many others in Lily’s book, Who Cares Wins, which is out now in hardback, ebook and audiobook.

Waterstones: https://bit.ly/30OsUtr

Audible: https://bit.ly/3jwS8UH

Apple: https://apple.co/2XT7TvM


Please find a reading list from our featured guests:

David Attenborough's new book, A Life on Our Planet:

Waterstones: https://bit.ly/30HCjCO

Audible: https://bit.ly/2FyV3g5

Carole Cadwalladr’s Ted Talk:


Rutger Bregman’s latest book: Humankind: a hopeful history


Music featured in the episode by Cosmo Sheldrake: Wriggle and Wake Up Calls, featuring recordings of endangered birds in Britain. 

More Episodes


COP 26 BONUS: What The Shell Is Going On? With Professor Gail Whiteman, Vanessa Nakate, Eriel Tchekwie Deranger and Tom B.K. Goldtooth (feat. Joe Lycett, Ben van Beurden, Lauren MacDonald, Chris James, Johan Rockström and Christiana Figueres)

Season 1, Ep. 10
For this bonus episode, Lily explores the issue at the centre of the climate crisis: fossil fuels. Lily also looks at green washing, and the new dangers posed by net-zero pledges.Lily shares insider access - and analysis of the infamous Edinburgh TED Countdown Summit from October 2021, where CEO ofShell Ben van Beurden was pressed on the company’s recently released ‘greenwashed’ net-zero plans, eliciting the first ever TED protest.After an emotional event that saw youth activists leave in protest, Lily is keen to revisit the discussion and give climate science more air-time. So for this episode, she spoke to Professor Gail Whiteman - one of the scientists who analysedShell’s “Sky Scenario” and interrupted the TED talk to challenge van Beurden’s plans.Lily also includes the voices of indigenous leaders, Eriel Tchekwie Deranger and Tom B.K. Goldtooth, who discuss the effects of fossil fuel companies on their land, and climate activist Vanessa NakateThanks to TED for their permission to include this talk in the episode, you can find the full talk via this linkThanks to Joe Lycett for letting us include his advert Joe Lycett Vs The Oil Giant | The Ad Shell Would NEVER MakeFor more on ErielTchekwie Derangerplease follow her work on Indigenous Climate Action.For more on Tom B.K. Goldtooth please follow his work at Indiginous Risingand the Indigenous Environmental Network.For more on Vanessa Nakate please follow activism over on TwitterFor more on the Stop Cambo campaign, mentioned by Lauren MacDonald, please visit their websiteTo learn more about Christiana Figueres, check out her book: The Future We ChooseAnd to learn more about the team of scientists among Professor Gail Whiteman at Arctic Basecamp, please visit the website.

How much should we care? With Patti Smith, Jonathan Safran Foer, Joshua Oppenheimer, Farhana Yamin, Julia Samuels and Wade Davis

Season 1, Ep. 8
In this final season episode of Who Cares Wins, Lily explores the overwhelm and grief that can come with climate action. But conversely, if we truly understand the destruction that is taking place, why do we continue with business as usual? Are many of us living in denial? We hear from poet-songwriter Patti Smith about what she learned from the Dalai Lama. Writer Jonathan Safran Foer discusses the emphatic leap required; and film-maker Joshua Oppenheimershares what he learnt about cognitive dissonance when filming The Act of Killing, and the stories we tell ourselves to justify our actions.Lily also speaks with climate activist and lawmaker Farhana Yamin about her journey to and through eco-grief, and psychologist Julia Samuels discusses her clinical experience ofeco-grief and anxiety, andtools we might use to lessonoverwhelm. Finally,Wade Davis offerswisdom from Tibet.You can find out more about Farhana Yamin and Jonathan Safran Foer, as well as many of thethemes explored in this episode, in Lily’s book, Who Cares Wins, which is out now in hardback, ebook and audiobook.Audible: https://bit.ly/3jwS8UHWaterstones: https://bit.ly/30OsUtrApple: https://apple.co/2XT7TvM With thanks to the How to Academy for allowing us the use of the interview with Jonathan Safran Foer. How to Academy have their own weekly podcast featuring some of the world's leading thinkers - available to stream from How To Academy dot com or wherever you get your podcasts. www.howtoacademy.com/podcastsAnd thanks to Yeti Television for allowing us the use of the interview with Patti Smith, as well as to Liz Friend, the Producer and Director of the interview.Please find a reading list and more information from our featured guests:Jonathan Safran Foer:https://www.penguin.co.uk/books/310/310101/we-are-the-weather/9780241984918.htmlJoshua Oppenheimer:https://shop.bfi.org.uk/joshua-oppenheimer-12-early-works.html Julia Samuels:https://www.waterstones.com/book/this-too-shall-pass/julia-samuel/9780241348864Wade Davis:https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/political-commentary/covid-19-end-of-american-era-wade-davis-1038206/