Who Cares Wins with Lily Cole


Is more better? With George Monbiot, Andrew McAfee, Aja Barber, John Sauven, Lisa Jackson and Merlin Sheldrake

Season 1, Ep. 6

In this week’s episode of Who Cares Wins, Lily explores how global economic development has both contributed to the climate crisis and, others argue, is helping solve it.

Lily speaks to the thought leaders in sustainability who question relentless economic growth: fashion consultant Aja Barber, director of Greenpeace UK John Sauven, and writer George Monbiot.

Lily also explores the other side of the debate; looking at Lisa Jackson’s work at Apple as a case study of corporate environmental ambition; and speaking with the principal research scientist at MIT Andrew Mcafee, who argues that it is possible to decouple economic growth from environmental impact, and that intense competition and technology (through growth) is already helping us to get “more from less.”

Finally, biologist and author Merlin Sheldrake helps listeners understand the role of growth, cooperation and competition in evolution.

You can learn more from George Monbiot, Lisa Jackson and other advocates of conscious consumerism or de-growth in Lily’s book, Who Cares Wins, which is out now in hardback, ebook and audiobook.

Waterstones: https://bit.ly/30OsUtr

Audible: https://bit.ly/3jwS8UH

Apple: https://apple.co/2XT7TvM

Please find a reading list from our featured guests, or their references:

Music featured in the episode by Cosmo Sheldrake: Wriggle and Wake Up Calls, featuring recordings of endangered birds in Britain. 

More Episodes


COP 26 BONUS: What The Shell Is Going On? With Professor Gail Whiteman, Vanessa Nakate, Eriel Tchekwie Deranger and Tom B.K. Goldtooth (feat. Joe Lycett, Ben van Beurden, Lauren MacDonald, Chris James, Johan Rockström and Christiana Figueres)

Season 1, Ep. 10
For this bonus episode, Lily explores the issue at the centre of the climate crisis: fossil fuels. Lily also looks at green washing, and the new dangers posed by net-zero pledges.Lily shares insider access - and analysis of the infamous Edinburgh TED Countdown Summit from October 2021, where CEO ofShell Ben van Beurden was pressed on the company’s recently released ‘greenwashed’ net-zero plans, eliciting the first ever TED protest.After an emotional event that saw youth activists leave in protest, Lily is keen to revisit the discussion and give climate science more air-time. So for this episode, she spoke to Professor Gail Whiteman - one of the scientists who analysedShell’s “Sky Scenario” and interrupted the TED talk to challenge van Beurden’s plans.Lily also includes the voices of indigenous leaders, Eriel Tchekwie Deranger and Tom B.K. Goldtooth, who discuss the effects of fossil fuel companies on their land, and climate activist Vanessa NakateThanks to TED for their permission to include this talk in the episode, you can find the full talk via this linkThanks to Joe Lycett for letting us include his advert Joe Lycett Vs The Oil Giant | The Ad Shell Would NEVER MakeFor more on ErielTchekwie Derangerplease follow her work on Indigenous Climate Action.For more on Tom B.K. Goldtooth please follow his work at Indiginous Risingand the Indigenous Environmental Network.For more on Vanessa Nakate please follow activism over on TwitterFor more on the Stop Cambo campaign, mentioned by Lauren MacDonald, please visit their websiteTo learn more about Christiana Figueres, check out her book: The Future We ChooseAnd to learn more about the team of scientists among Professor Gail Whiteman at Arctic Basecamp, please visit the website.

How much should we care? With Patti Smith, Jonathan Safran Foer, Joshua Oppenheimer, Farhana Yamin, Julia Samuels and Wade Davis

Season 1, Ep. 8
In this final season episode of Who Cares Wins, Lily explores the overwhelm and grief that can come with climate action. But conversely, if we truly understand the destruction that is taking place, why do we continue with business as usual? Are many of us living in denial? We hear from poet-songwriter Patti Smith about what she learned from the Dalai Lama. Writer Jonathan Safran Foer discusses the emphatic leap required; and film-maker Joshua Oppenheimershares what he learnt about cognitive dissonance when filming The Act of Killing, and the stories we tell ourselves to justify our actions.Lily also speaks with climate activist and lawmaker Farhana Yamin about her journey to and through eco-grief, and psychologist Julia Samuels discusses her clinical experience ofeco-grief and anxiety, andtools we might use to lessonoverwhelm. Finally,Wade Davis offerswisdom from Tibet.You can find out more about Farhana Yamin and Jonathan Safran Foer, as well as many of thethemes explored in this episode, in Lily’s book, Who Cares Wins, which is out now in hardback, ebook and audiobook.Audible: https://bit.ly/3jwS8UHWaterstones: https://bit.ly/30OsUtrApple: https://apple.co/2XT7TvM With thanks to the How to Academy for allowing us the use of the interview with Jonathan Safran Foer. How to Academy have their own weekly podcast featuring some of the world's leading thinkers - available to stream from How To Academy dot com or wherever you get your podcasts. www.howtoacademy.com/podcastsAnd thanks to Yeti Television for allowing us the use of the interview with Patti Smith, as well as to Liz Friend, the Producer and Director of the interview.Please find a reading list and more information from our featured guests:Jonathan Safran Foer:https://www.penguin.co.uk/books/310/310101/we-are-the-weather/9780241984918.htmlJoshua Oppenheimer:https://shop.bfi.org.uk/joshua-oppenheimer-12-early-works.html Julia Samuels:https://www.waterstones.com/book/this-too-shall-pass/julia-samuel/9780241348864Wade Davis:https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/political-commentary/covid-19-end-of-american-era-wade-davis-1038206/