The Problem With B2B Marketing

In this special episode of 'The Problem with B2B Marketing', Kevin Sutherland broadcasts from the Legal Marketing Association's inaugural European conference in London, themed 'Strategies for the Future.' The episode provides insights into tackling current challenges and leveraging new technologies for future growth in legal marketing.The episode features discussions with key stakeholders including Karen Morton, Chief Marketing Officer, Cleary Gottlieb Steen & Hamilton LLP and President, LMA Europe, 2025 plus panel hosts and panelists including Peter Skinner, Marketing & BD Director (CMO), Wedlake Bell, Michelle Holford, Chief Commercial Officer, Slaughter & May, Owen Williams, Partner, Director of Marketing & BD, Simmons & Simmons, Shirley Meyers, Head of Marketing, BDBF, Vanessa Montero, Chief Communications Officer, Hogan Lovells, Heather Vadgama, CMO, Walkers, Raya Blakeley-Glover, Global Head of Business Development & Sales, Bird & Bird & Mike Beswick, BD, Marketing & Communications Director, Taylor Wessing.Over the course of the episode we summarise and expand on the topics discussed on stage, including the evolving role of the CMs, the use of Data and AI in legal marketing, plus personal branding and growth strategies. Participants discuss real, practical strategies for unlocking the potential in a Firm’s data, what it takes to become truly client-centric, and how to maintain authenticity in personal branding. 00:48 Interview with Karen Morton: Strategies for the Future07:18 The Evolving Role of the CMO27:11 Building Your Personal Brand44:39 Leveraging Data for Growth in Legal Marketing

In this episode of 'The Problem with B2B Marketing,' Kevin Sutherland speaks with Jason Miller, Head of Marketing at Jigsaw, ex-Marketo - and former B2B Marketing evangelist at Linkedin - about a specific and critical challenge affecting the performance of content marketing for so many firms. The discussion centres on the foundational issues in B2B content today, including the ‘lost art’ of positioning, messaging, and value propositions. They explore how brands often focus more on tactics over strategy, leading to diminishing returns and increased costs. Jason emphasises the need for a clear messaging framework and outlines the role of creativity and community in building a successful marketing strategy. The episode also touches on the impact of AI - especially on entry-level careers -  the importance of passion projects in avoiding burnout, and the necessity of finding innovative ways to connect with audiences.Over 40-ish minutes we cover:03:27 The Lost Art of Positioning and Messaging08:05 The Evolution of B2B Marketing Strategies11:52 The Importance of Brand and Creativity21:13 Challenges for Entry-Level Marketers in the AI Era23:41 The Importance of Short Form Video and AI24:01 Complaints About Virality and Algorithm Hacks25:06 Balancing Life and Carving Out Time30:31 The Role of Community in B2B Marketing33:15 The Impact of AI on Content and Messaging

Is marketing having an identity crisis? In this episode, Kevin sits down with Dom Hawes, CEO of agency group Selbey Anderson, to ask why so much B2B marketing has become narrowly focused on content and comms, at the expense of strategy, pricing, product, and customer value. Dom argues that we’ve reduced a business-critical discipline to “T-shirts, mugs, and websites” - and it’s time to fix it.From the untapped power of pricing to the rise of “untitled marketers,” and the problem with even calling it ‘B2B…’ this episode is a thought-provoking take on what business marketing really is, and what we all should be doing instead of ‘looking in the wrong direction…”We cover:Why marketing needs to reclaim its role as a strategic business driver - “There's a generation of ‘untitled marketers’ - they’re in operations, customer success, even product - but they’re doing more real marketing than the marketing department.”How brands lose value when marketing is reduced to comms - “If your marketing function isn’t touching price, product, or distribution, you’re not doing marketing.”What marketers can learn from DevOps and why AI will reshape agencies - “AI won’t kill agencies, but the ones that can’t shift from outputs to outcomes will struggle.”Why being “more human” is too lazy a goal.The trouble with orthodoxies like 95/5, and how they mislead - “The 95/5 model is misused. It's become another stick to hit marketers with instead of helping them think.”How to stop trying to “do more” and start focusing on impact - “A great marketer starts with three questions: Who is the customer? What do they want? And how do I create more value than the next guy?”The ‘pile-on’ culture on LinkedIn, and why it undermines the profession - “People pile in to attack ideas they don’t like. That’s not thought leadership, it’s thought policing.”Why ROI is the wrong conversation, and what to measure instead.About our guest:Dom Hawes is Group CEO at Selbey Anderson, a marketing group comprising five specialist agencies. A long-time champion for marketing as a strategic business discipline, he also hosts the Unicorny podcast. Dom is a sharp thinker with strong opinions — on brand, growth, AI, and the future of the agency model — and in this episode, he shares them with honesty and impact.

Building a B2B community sounds great in theory but how do you make one that actually delivers value? In this episode, Kevin talks to Pip Jamieson, founder of community platform The Dots, about what it really takes to build and scale communities that work. From understanding your ideal customer to choosing the right tech, Pip shares practical advice for brands and startups alike.You’ll hear why community is more than just an extension of content strategy, why social media managers aren’t community leads, and how “super fans” can be a driver of growth.We cover:What separates real communities from audiences or databasesThe case for buying or licensing over building techHow startups can use “super fan” groups to scaleWhat metrics to track (spoiler: not just likes…) and how branded communities powered by The Dots achieve 50% active engagement rates, compared to single-digit figures typical in social mediaWhy ‘lurkers’ matter - and what makes a great curatorThe biggest mistake brands make when hiring for communityPip’s honest advice for aspiring tech foundersHow AI is reshaping her own business - and where the biggest gaps still lieAbout our guest:Pip Jamieson is the founder and CEO of The Dots - a private community platform used by brands like Apple, Soho House, and Frieze. A longtime advocate for creative industries and inclusive tech, Pip shares her insights from launching and scaling digital products in both the UK and Australia.

In this episode, we’re joined by Matthew Magee, Head of Digital Content at Pinsent Masons, which has been the most visited legal firm website in the world, every month, for the past 20 years. Drawing on his background as a journalist and his experience leading one of the most respected content operations in professional services, Matthew shares how the firm’s flagship platform, Out-Law, delivers true value to clients and prospects by getting the expertise and knowledge inside the firm out into the market, and why quality always wins out over quantity.Matthew explains why so much content marketing often fails to deliver for the audience in B2B, how to create structures that elevate rather than dilute expertise, and what makes Out-Law a different beast to the sea of “thought leadership” swamping inboxes. He also shares his admiration for content powerhouses like EY and offers advice to aspiring content professionals.Talking Points:Why content should be led by content people - “If you want content done properly, get content people to do it — and give them the backing to challenge the status quo”The importance of structure, process, and editorial confidence in surfacing firm-wide expertiseHow Out-Law has built a trusted audience by behaving more like a newsroom than a marketing teamWhy internal power structures often shape external content (and how to break that pattern)Why AI-content 'gumming up' the channels might be good for firms like Pinsent MasonsWhat professional services firms can learn from the consistency and clarity of the Big FourWhy early-career content people still benefit from newsroom rigour - even as those environments disappearThe problem with data: how non-experts can learn to ask better questions about content performanceAnd, adding to our growing collection of marketing analogies, meet Shrödingers content marketing…https://www.pinsentmasons.com/out-law 

In this episode of The Problem with B2B Marketing, Kevin Sutherland is joined by Michelle Booth, former head of marketing strategy & innovation at NatWest, and former head of Growth & innovation at Lloyds, now on Sabbatical studying performance at Central St Martins to talk about the challenge of making real change happen inside organisations.Episode SummaryChange may be constant, but making it happen is another matter. Whether it’s digital transformation, cultural shifts, or just evolving the processes that make the business work, many organisations struggle to turn ambitions into real action, or adapt effectively to changing markets.Michelle and Kevin discuss the realities of organisational change, why so many initiatives stall, and what makes the difference between a plan that gathers dust and one that actually delivers results. Key Talking PointsThe gap between strategy and execution - why change often gets stuck before it startsHow internal culture and behaviours shape whether change succeeds or failsThe risk of overcomplicating change with frameworks and methodologiesWhy people, not just processes, should be at the heart of any change initiativeThe balance between stability and adaptation - how to evolve without constant disruptionThe myth of agility - why moving fast doesn’t always mean making progressWhat B2B marketing’s brand vs. performance debate can teach us about long-term vs. short-term changeWhy small, targeted interventions often work better than large-scale change programsThe power of asking the right questions - and why many organisations avoid the difficult onesHow external consultants can be useful - but why they’re sometimes brought in just to confirm what leadership already thinksThe tension between efficiency and growth - and why cutting costs isn’t the same as making progressChange is inevitable, but that doesn’t mean it’s easy. So how do B2B businesses move from talking about change to actually making it happen? Tune in for a conversation about what works, what doesn’t, and why real change is often more subtle than it seems.Links and further reading on the topics discussed:On dealing with uncertainty: Brian Klass: Fluke - Chance, Chaos, and Why Everything We Do Matters On dealing with Uncertainty Dr Amy Edmondson “Right Kind of Wrong: The science of failing well”Andre Spicer - Power and Pitfalls of Functional stupidity Geoffrey Moore Zone to Win (and Crossing the Chasm)

In this episode of The Problem with B2B Marketing, Kevin Sutherland is joined by Joel Harrison of B2BMarketing.net and Katy Howell of Immediate Future to discuss the problem with influencer marketing.As the B2B creator economy gains momentum, brands are rethinking how they connect with professional audiences. With LinkedIn becoming more conversational, the traditional “stuffy” approach to thought leadership is shifting toward a more human, expert-driven model. But what does this mean for B2B brand building and marketing comms?Trust in business communications is at an all-time low, and the explosion of AI-generated content isn’t helping. So, where does that leave B2B brands looking to build credibility? In this episode we explore the evolution of B2B influencer marketing, why it’s not actually new, and how brands can leverage trusted voices to cut through the noise.Key Talking PointsThe concept of influencer marketing has always existed in B2B, from PR editorial to thought leadershipThe challenges of working with individual influencers versus traditional media platformsHow B2B media publications are adapting to the influencer era The role of subject matter experts within organisations and how businesses can nurture and empower them The blurred lines between thought leaders, internal influencers, and those who build their personal brands outside their employer’s umbrellaWhy niche expertise matters more than broad industry influence when selecting collaboratorsThe growing importance of long-term collaboration over transactional relationships in B2B influence strategiesThe tricky topic of risk: How can brands ensure they partner with the right influencers? What does due diligence look like?Why AI-generated content is making thought leadership harder, not easier—and how brands can stand out with original, evidence-backed insightsHow a Fujitsu influencer-led campaign generated an attributed pipeline of £38MAnd perhaps most crucially, can marketers prove the ROI of B2B influencer campaigns?With LinkedIn doubling down on the creator economy and formal influencer platforms emerging in the B2B space, the question is no longer whether influencer marketing is relevant—it’s how brands can make it work effectively.Tune in to hear our take on where B2B influencer marketing is headed and what smart CMOs should be doing to stay ahead.

In this episode of The Problem with B2B Marketing, Kevin Sutherland is joined by Gemma Greaves, co-founder of Nurture & Partners, to tackle an issue many find uncomfortable: networking. Gemma shares her candid perspective on why traditional networking methods often fail, how to overcome the awkwardness, and why reframing it as “not working” can unlock more meaningful connections.Drawing from her personal experiences and professional insights, Gemma challenges the stereotypes around networking and explains how focusing on authenticity, generosity, and curiosity can lead to stronger, more impactful relationships in business.Key Talking Points:Why the Word “Networking” Needs a Rebrand:Gemma explains her dislike for the term “networking” and its connotations of transactional, insincere interactionsTraditional tactics like exchanging business cards or pitching immediately are not only ineffective but often damaging to long-term relationshipsReframing Networking as “Not Working”:Approaching events with the mindset of meeting interesting people rather than seeking immediate outcomesBuilding genuine connections starts with being yourself and fostering a welcoming environment for othersThe Importance of First Impressions:How event organisers can set the tone for meaningful interactions from the moment someone walks into a roomWhy “first impressions are made fast, and they last.”Three Pillars of Effective Connection Building:Authenticity: “Be you, so others can be them”Generosity: Focus on what you can give, rather than what you can gainCuriosity: Ask thoughtful questions to deepen your understanding of othersKnowing yourselfHow self-awareness and embracing your vulnerabilities can lead to more genuine connections.Using the "two pots" analogy (evidence vs. thoughts/feelings)The responsibility of leadershipRole-modelling vulnerability and authenticityWhy fun and joy in the workplace are essential