The ManFlu | Exploring Gender Dynamics, Partnerships & Raising Boys Who Care

Julia Markish sat at a dinner party while the women around her swapped stories about burnout and the mental load. She has a wife, so she couldn't relate. Still her first thought was a guilty one: Am I the man in this story? Host Lucy McAfee talks with Julia, an executive coach, and her wife Krissa Lagos, a book editor, in the first couple's interview on The ManFlu. When Lucy asked if Krissa would've had her own complaint at that dinner party, the answer was no. They both have their roles, and balance was one of the seven touchstones they built their wedding ceremony and marriage around. Krissa cooks and Julia cleans. Julia schedules the checkups and Krissa keeps each day on track. When Krissa realized she kept landing in the kitchen prepping food while Julia got the fun part with their son, they talked about it and found a fairer way to divide the morning.Gratitude in relationships runs through all of it. Julia and Krissa thank each other for small things and have learned to ask when the thanks doesn't come. They also talk about raising boys with room to feel, and how the trans men in their San Francisco community can show their son a different kind of masculinity.Press play for a model of how same-sex couples divide household labor that any couple can borrow, plus one small shift you can try at home this week.Episode Breakdown:00:00 Welcome And Meeting Julia and Krissa02:35 The Dinner Party Where Julia Couldn't Relate05:49 The Breakfast Prep Fix That Restored Fairness08:40 Building A Marriage Around Seven Touchstones12:43 Why Being With A Woman Can Feel Easier18:13 Raising The Flag When You Need Thanks20:41 Raising Their Son In A Queer Community28:46 How Their Careers Shape Life At Home32:41 What Straight Couples Can Borrow From Them38:01 The One Small Shift: Ask For The ThanksReferenced on the Show:Episode 9: The Manosphere and our Boys: What It’s Teaching Them, What We Can DoFarideh, songs about parenting and motherhoodConnect with Julia Markish & Krissa Lagos:Visit the Embrace the Human websiteVisit Krissa’s websiteConnect with Lucy McAfee:Follow Lucy on InstagramConnect with Lucy on LinkedInVisit The ManFlu websitePodcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Long before mental load and maternal burnout were in our common vernacular, our guest this week had a moment that clearly illustrated them: rushing out the door for work, unable to find a glove, and deciding that if she couldn't find it, she was done.Host Lucy McAfee sits down with her mom, Eileen Goeke, a retired high school teacher and mother of four, to compare motherhood across two generations. Eileen lived in 10 houses in ten years, built new communities in small towns, and eventually returned to teaching without ever having a conversation with her husband about how the responsibilities at home would change. Lucy asks how Eileen found her village then and why building that kind of support can feel harder for parents today.After nearly 30 years in the classroom, Eileen also saw major changes in the boys she taught. Earlier in her career, many boys seemed to have a clearer sense of what came next after high school. Over time, she saw more students struggle to figure out where they fit as their options and expectations changed. She and Lucy talk about phones in the classroom, parents stepping in to solve problems, and how giving kids more choices can sometimes make life harder. Eileen also shares the simple habit that helped teenage boys slow down and talk to her.Listen for Eileen's perspective on letting go of some of the pressure around motherhood, from resisting the urge to apologize for a messy house to deciding which choices really deserve your time and attention.Episode Breakdown:00:00 Meet Eileen, Lucy's Mom and Longtime Teacher03:35 Four Kids, Ten Houses, and Building a Village08:47 Going Back to Work Without a Conversation11:24 The Glove Story and Motherhood Burnout18:14 Why the Doorbell Still Triggers House Apologies21:05 Watching Boys Lose Their Clear Next Step26:54 Phones, Parent Pushback, and Too Many Choices37:39 The Comparison Trap and Finding Yourself45:32 Skip the Decision Tree on Small Choices48:22 Sitting on It With Teenage BoysConnect with Lucy McAfee:Instagram: @lucypmcafeeLinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/lucymcafeeShow Website: https://shows.acast.com/the-manfluPodcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

The Manosphere doesn't need boys to go looking for it. Researchers who set up TikTok and YouTube accounts posing as teenage boys found it reached their feeds within 26 minutes, starting from nothing more than a fitness video or a gaming clip.Host Lucy McAfee spends this episode of The ManFlu Podcast unpacking the Manosphere, the vast online world of influencers, podcasts, and communities shaping how boys think about masculinity, women, success, and their own worth. She uses Netflix's Adolescence and Louis Theroux's Inside the Manosphere as her way into the topic, then digs into what boys are actually absorbing once the algorithm gets them there.At the center of it is a dangerous idea: that men are born without value and have to earn it through money, strength, status, and attention from women. Lucy connects that message to therapist Terry Real's distinction between healthy self-esteem and performance-based self-esteem, and traces the childhoods behind some of the biggest names selling this content. She also explains the term incel and how ordinary teenage loneliness gets twisted into resentment and blame.The answer isn't simply keeping boys offline, since these messages can reach them anywhere. The bigger opportunity is helping them question what they're hearing and making home a place where they can bring it up. Lucy closes with one small shift: a set of age-specific questions parents can start asking this week to keep that door open, so we're raising boys who know exactly who they can talk to.Episode Breakdown:00:00 Why Lucy Is Tackling The Manosphere04:44 Defining The Manosphere In Plain Terms09:34 The Idea That Men Are Born Without Value14:22 Tate Brothers' Arrests And Followers' Response21:32 The Childhoods Behind These Influencers23:57 Healthy Versus Performance-Based Self-Esteem28:50 One Small Shift To Start The ConversationConnect with Lucy McAfee:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lucypmcafee LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/lucymcafeeShow Website: https://shows.acast.com/the-manfluMentioned in this episodeAdolescence on NetflixLouis Theroux: Inside the Manosphere on NetflixTalk to Your Boys by Joanna Schroeder and Christopher PepperEntitled by Kate ManneTerry RealEpisode 4 with Julie MesserSourcesDublin City University: Recommending ToxicityU.S. Secret Service: Mass Attacks in Public Spaces, 2016–2020CDC suicide dataAssociated Press reporting on the Tate brothers’ arrestThis episode includes a discussion of suicide. If you or someone you know needs support, call or text 988 or visit the 988 Suicide & Crisis Lifeline.Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Some women carry the mental load in marriage so quietly that even their own husbands don't see it happening.Host Lucy McAfee sits down with Victoria Tice, a copywriter and birth doula. Victoria has spent five years breastfeeding her two sons on demand, no pumps, no bottles, straight from the source.  And that choice opened up a much bigger conversation about partnership, recovery, and who carries what at home.Victoria compares her husband's five days of paternity leave with their first son to the nearly four months he took with their second, and why that difference changed her postpartum recovery completely. She and Lucy get into the list Victoria and her husband built together, naming every task that keeps a home running, and the exact language she uses now when dividing household responsibilities without becoming the house manager who reminds him of everything.They also take on the maternal instinct myth, the idea that mothers are simply born knowing what to do while fathers get room to learn as they go. It is another face of the mental load in marriage, deciding everything so no one else has to. Press play to hear Victoria's simple weekly habit for protecting her own time and why she says letting your partner fail is part of learning to actually share it.Episode Breakdown:00:00 Welcome And Meeting Victoria Tice02:13 Five Years Of Exclusive Breastfeeding Explained04:18 The Plan That Wasn't Really A Plan08:27 Doing It All Alone With Baby One12:31 Five Days Leave Versus Four Months15:58 The Pressure Fathers Feel Taking Leave20:43 When Travel Broke Their Family Rhythm25:43 Building A Fairness List With Fair Play30:17 Naming The Mental Load In Marriage38:21 The One Small Shift To Try This WeekConnect with Victoria Tice:Website: https://www.victoriajtice.comInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/truenorth.birth TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@theticehouse Connect with Lucy McAfee:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lucypmcafee LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/lucymcafeeShow Website: https://shows.acast.com/the-manfluPodcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

What is a life spent caring for a family worth? Our guest learned an insurer's answer the day it reduced hers to three words: just a housewife. The work of making a house a home can hold enormous value and still be assigned none.On The ManFlu, host Lucy McAfee talks with Lori Sugarman-Li, a family systems strategist, speaker, and Certified Fair Play Facilitator, about invisible labor, the mental load, and what children learn from watching who carries the work of home. After a 15-year marketing career with Kraft Foods and Four Seasons Hotels and Resorts, Lori shifted full-time into what she calls the economy of care. Her experience eventually led her to Fair Play, the system created by Eve Rodsky, and a new way of thinking about how families talk about household responsibility.For parents looking for a fair play method for kids, Lori's approach starts with helping children see themselves as participants in family life rather than occasional helpers. She points to research showing that the gender gap begins early, with girls ages 5–14 already doing more unpaid care and domestic work than boys their age. As a mom of two teenage sons, Lori talks about raising boys to share household labor, giving kids meaningful responsibility, and letting them learn through mistakes.She also shares her perspective on teaching kids chores without allowance, separating household contributions from financial literacy so caring for a family isn't reduced to a paycheck. The bigger goal is not a perfectly folded load of laundry. It is creating more room for equal rest, joy, connection, and responsibility across the family.Lori's one small shift starts with gratitude. The work of home may still be repetitive and exhausting, but changing how a family sees that work can change how they value it, share it, and show up for one another. Her award-winning children's book, Our Home: The Love, Work, and Heart of Family, carries the same idea to the youngest readers, reframing the everyday jobs of home as acts of love.Books Referenced:Our Home: The Love, Work, and Heart of Family by Lori Sugarman-LiFair Play: A Game-Changing Solution for When You Have Too Much to Do (and More Life to Live) by Eve RodskyEpisode Breakdown:00:00 Welcome And Meeting Lori Sugarman-Li02:27 The Disability Insurance Denial That Changed Everything09:51 Rebranding Chores As Acts Of Gratitude15:52 Resetting Roles After Falling Into Old Scripts19:43 Equal Leisure Time And Equal Joy23:18 Building Your Family's Core Values Together26:22 Matching Kids To Tasks They're Wired For29:19 Teaching Kids Chores Without Tying Them To Allowance32:28 Raising Boys To Value Unpaid Care Work39:22 Letting Kids Learn From Their Own Mistakes42:59 One Small Shift For Leading With GratitudeConnect with Lori Sugarman-Li:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ourhomeourpride/ Website: https://ourhomeourpride.comLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/lori-sugarman-li-50592911 Connect with Lucy McAfee:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lucypmcafee LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/lucymcafeeShow Website: https://shows.acast.com/the-manfluPodcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Do you ever get to the end of the day, a day where you genuinely never stopped moving, and still feel like you somehow failed? That feeling usually isn't proof that you fell short. It's proof that you're chasing a standard that was never realistic to begin with.Host Lucy McAfee talks with Jess Weisz, former McKinsey consultant, writer, coach, and creator of Rule Breaker, about the invisible standards behind working parent burnout, and why high-achieving parents can spend an entire day getting things done and still feel like they failed.It started with a notebook. Six months postpartum, Jess's partner asked her to write down everything on her mind. What poured out wasn't a to-do list. It was a heaping pile of expectations no one could realistically meet, and that mental load became the work of Rule Breaker.Jess pulls out her childhood report cards to get at something deeper: judgment. We're raised being graded, taught to prove ourselves against a fixed set of expectations, and no one ever sends the memo that the report cards stop coming once we graduate. We just keep grading ourselves against one that no longer exists.That pressure shows up in surprisingly small places. For Jess, homemade muffins can feel like proof that she's doing motherhood right, and a granola bar can trigger the opposite reaction. She and Lucy unpack self-esteem and motherhood, and how easily our sense of worth gets pegged to the most ordinary choices.Part of the trap is confusing capability with capacity. Being able to do something doesn't mean you have the time, energy, or space for it right now. Work-life balance for working parents can look less like finding the perfect schedule and more like letting go of unrealistic parenting expectations. Jess shares how to question the rules running in the background, decide which expectations deserve your attention, set boundaries around the rest, and recognize when something is enough. She leaves listeners with one question to reach for when mom guilt starts creeping in.Did I agree to this rule?Press play to hear the full conversation, and follow The ManFlu with Lucy McAfee for more conversations about the scripts shaping how we parent, partner, and share the load at home.Episode Breakdown:00:00 Welcome To The ManFlu With Lucy McAfee00:39 Meet Jess Weisz, Creator Of Rule Breaker02:03 What The Rule Breaker Reset Is All About03:38 The Notebook That Started This Whole Reckoning06:05 Social Media And The Rise Of Working Mom Guilt10:10 Where This Impossible Standard Actually Came From14:19 The Report Cards We Never Stop Grading Ourselves Against15:32 Awareness, Choice, And Enoughness Explained22:09 Pegging Self-Esteem To Muffins And Meals27:32 Identity Versus Values When Choosing Your Rules30:49 Real Rules People Have Put In The Corner39:44 The One Small Shift: Did I Agree To This Rule?Connect with Jess Weisz:Substack: rulebreaker.substack.comLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jessicaweiszWebsite: reset.rulebreaker.coInsta: @rulebreakerjessConnect with Lucy McAfee:Instagram: @lucypmcafeeLinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/lucymcafeeShow Website: https://shows.acast.com/the-manfluPodcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Everyone tells new parents it takes a village. Nobody mentions that making mom friends as an adult is genuinely hard and can feel more like dating: is it weird to ask for her number? Do I look like a stalker?Host Lucy McAfee talks with Jessica Hill, founder and CEO of The Parent Collective, about building your village as a new mom. Jessica spent ten years in England, where prenatal classes grouped expectant parents by neighborhood and due date. She left with a built-in support system and friendships that lasted long after the newborn stage. When she returned to the States, she found playgrounds full of mothers who said they did not find their people until their kids started school. That gap became the reason she created The Parent Collective.Jessica explains how to build a support system as a new mom when those connections do not happen automatically. Her advice is simple, though not always easy: choose something you genuinely care about, put yourself in places where you will see the same people regularly, and keep showing up when the first few attempts do not lead anywhere. You may not meet a lifelong best friend. Sometimes a "for-now friend" who understands the exact season you are in is enough to make motherhood feel less isolating. And if the newborn stage came and went without your people showing up, it's not too late. Jessica shares practical ways to start building that village right now, wherever you are.The conversation turns to the Fair Play method, the mental load, and maternal gatekeeping. Jessica shares how a bedtime dance party helped her recognize that her husband needed room to parent in his own way and create separate traditions with their sons. She explains how they divided responsibilities around weekend meals, soccer, and the Saturday "curriculum" he created for their boys. The episode closes with one practical shift for a fairer partnership: when one parent gets protected free time, the other should receive it too, and both should be encouraged to spend that time doing something that restores them.Press play for practical ways to make mom friends, share the parenting load, and raise boys who understand what it means to show up for the people they love.Episode Breakdown:00:00 Meet Jessica Hill, Founder of The Parent Collective02:26 Ten Years In England And A Built-In Village09:54 When Your Village Lives Online11:51 Why Asking For Help Feels Like Weakness15:51 Inside The Parent Collective's Four Week Class Series19:59 The Power Of Finding A For Now Friend22:18 Building Your Village Beyond The Newborn Phase29:58 The Bedtime Dance Party That Changed the Rules34:53 Splitting Parenting Roles And Raising Partner-Ready Boys40:52 The One Small Shift: Free Time That's Actually FairConnect with Jessica Hill:Visit The Parent Collective websiteFollow The Parent Collective on InstagramConnect with Jessica on LinkedInConnect with Lucy McAfee:Follow Lucy on InstagramConnect with Lucy on LinkedInVisit The ManFlu websitePodcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Connection isn't something boys lack. It's something that gets nurtured, at the dinner table, on the drive home, in all the small moments in between. And right now, screens are competing for too many of those moments.Host Lucy McAfee talks with licensed marriage and family therapist Julie Messer about raising boys who can stay present, emotionally aware, and connected in a world built around quick rewards. As a therapist and fellow boy mom, Julie sees young men struggling with loneliness, anxiety, pornography, video games, and the ability to express what they feel. Those patterns often begin much earlier, through what boys learn about relationships, attention, and emotional intelligence at home.When mothers carry the mental load and become the parent everyone relies on, sons absorb that model of partnership. Fathers may miss everyday opportunities to build closeness through caregiving, chores, and the ordinary work of family life. Screens can deepen the disconnect by replacing the slower experiences that build patience, creativity, and real relationships. Julie also shares two of her favorite antidotes: unstructured time in nature and raising boys who love to read, both quiet gateways to empathy and attention.Julie explains why delayed gratification matters, why individual screens raise particular concerns, and why kids need more chances to work, wait, create, and connect without constant stimulation. Lucy is honest about her own family's screen habits and the difficulty of choosing connection when connection requires more energy. This conversation is not about perfect parenting. It is about noticing what boys are learning and making small changes while there is still time: sharing responsibility at home, creating more communal experiences, and teaching boys how to show up for the people around them.Episode Breakdown:00:00 Welcome And Meeting Therapist Julie Messer 02:25 The Most Common Friction Point Julie Sees In Therapy 05:46 Why The Dish Was Never About The Dish 08:16 How Mental Load Gets Modeled For Our Sons 09:40 Breaking The Mommy Does Everything Pattern 12:18 What Hunt Gather Parent Taught Julie About Independence 15:24 Overparenting, Anxiety, And The Anxious Generation 19:48 Why Patriarchy Fails Men Too 22:14 Screens, Sports, And Hijacking The Dopamine System 25:42 Sports, Mental Load, And What Men Remember 26:43 Parallel Play: How Boys Learn Side By Side 30:48 What A Week At Screen-Free Camp Changed32:36 Nature As The Antidote35:07 Raising Readers, Raising Empathy 41:10 Teaching Kids Delayed Gratification 43:14 One Small Shift To Build Real ConnectionBooks referenced:• A Little Scribble SPOT and the A Little SPOT series by Diane Alber — https://www.dianealber.com/collections/spot-series (single book: https://www.dianealber.com/products/a-little-scribble-spot-a-story-about-colorful-emotions)• Hunt, Gather, Parent by Michaeleen Doucleff — https://bookshop.org/p/books/hunt-gather-parent-what-ancient-cultures-can-teach-us-about-the-lost-art-of-raising-happy-helpful-little-humans-michaeleen-doucleff/5848320ecc6fea42?ean=9781982149680• The Anxious Generation by Jonathan Haidt — https://bookshop.org/p/books/the-anxious-generation-how-the-great-rewiring-of-childhood-is-causing-an-epidemic-of-mental-illness-jonathan-haidt/e7dfa59b478f9574?ean=9780593655030• Dopamine Nation by Dr. Anna Lembke — https://bookshop.org/p/books/dopamine-nation-finding-balance-in-the-age-of-indulgence-dr-anna-lembke/6cec20cd059cbe98?ean=9781524746742• This Is How Your Marriage Ends by Matthew Fray — https://bookshop.org/p/books/this-is-how-your-marriage-ends-a-hopeful-approach-to-saving-relationships-matthew-fray/d1e48fbd9afa7612?ean=9780063072268Connect with Julie Messer:Visit Julie's website Connect with Lucy McAfee:Follow Lucy on InstagramConnect with Lucy on LinkedInVisit The ManFlu websitePodcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm