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Spinning Plates with Sophie Ellis-Bextor
Episode 93: Dr Sabrina Cohen-Hatton
Dr Sabrina Cohen-Hatton (or Sab) took my breath away when I met her. She has achieved, and continues to achieve, so much despite her early life being incredibly tough.
Sab found herself homeless aged 16 after her beloved Dad died and her mum's mental health crumbled. She talked to me about how she has suffered from hyper-vigilance ever since, as the strategies she developed for keeping safe while sleeping rough, are still there.
She eventually found a place to live and was determined to become a fire fighter, applying to over 30 places before being accepted aged 18. She is now Chief Fire Officer of the West Sussex Fire and Rescue Service.
She met her husband Mike in her early days in the fire service. Following an incident in which she believed Mike had been seriously injured, Sab wrote a research paper on the mechanisms of decision-making under pressure. She has a First Class degree in Psychology, a Masters in International Fire Service Development and a PhD in Behavioural Neuroscince.
Sab has been faced with a lot of gender bias while in the Fire Service (for example in social settings people will say, 'Oh you're so brave' to a male firefighter; but 'Aren't you afraid?' to female firefighters. She has frequently experienced 'the backlash effect' when people are uncomfortable with you because you are doing a job associated with the opposite gender. She recently published her book 'The Gender Bias' which looks at the everyday prejudices which women experience and also has some practical solutions to offer. In our chat she clearly illustrated this, describing two very striking studies of little children. One study (as it happens, involving a firefighter's pole!) showed how parents unconsciously treat sons and daughters differently when it comes to perceived risk; the other study showed how children also have gender biases from a very young age, but how this can be reversed easily when they're little.
Sab and her husband Mike have a teenage daughter Gabby. Sab remembers how she started her PhD the day Gabby was born (yes, I don't blame you if you have to read that sentence twice!) and was promoted the day she went on maternity leave. She and Mike have been a tight parenting team, but interestingly Sab told me Mike experienced his own backlash when he took their daughter to baby classes, with mums of the other babies tending to gatekeep their maternal role and keep Mike at a slight distance.
Now that Gabby is a teenager, Sab is having flashbacks to her own teenage years and remembering more vividly that she was sleeping rough in a shop doorway aged 15, with people walking past her as if she wasn't really there. She told me how important it is to smile, have eye contact and say hello to homeless people, even if you don't have any change. If anyone knows, Sab does.
Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones
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139. Episode 139: Lliana Bird
01:01:48||Season 14, Ep. 139Lliana Bird is a writer, broadcaster and co-founder of the charity Choose Love. She describes herself as a butterfly flitting from flower to flower. She was also the longest employed female DJ - for 16 years - at Xfm and then Radio X as it is now called.Lliana and her partner Noel Fielding have two girls, Dali and Iggy, aged 2 and 4, and Lliana told me how their house might be described as over-stimulating by some, with constant music, curated mostly by Noel but increasingly by the children, and with art being created on giant canvases in the kitchen, with paint splats everywhere.Lliana's first children’s book ‘Baboo the unusual Bee’ has just come out in paperback. She revealed that she actually wrote it while breastfeeding and she’s now working on the stage show version of it.As my mum would say: "She's no slouch"!Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones.
138. Episode 138: Sara Pascoe
01:11:53||Season 14, Ep. 138Sara Pascoe is a stand up comedian who I particularly love. She now has two little boys after a long period of trying for a baby, including IVF. She spoke honestly to me about how she can remember being in a liminal head space for a long time while trying for a baby, and acknowledges she was 'horribly spiky' about parenthood before she had her boys, realising now that it was self-protection and a coping mechanism. She shared that she recently had a phone call from Robbie Williams who she idolised as a teenager, and how that made her feel like god, manifesting her teenage desires in her 40s!She also told me that if she was Prime Minister she would limit everyone to 2 hours screen time per day and that she reckoned we'd all secretly like her for it!Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones.
137. Episode 137: Holly McNish
01:20:44||Season 14, Ep. 137Hollie McNish is a poet who tours the country performing her poems. She says the whole of the UK is full of amazing theatres and bookshops.I love Hollie's writing, the way she looks at motherhood, and how she always stand up for her small person, which I feel is empowering for them both. I was delighted when she offered to read one of my favourite poems of hers during our chat.Hollie told me how she books her own gigs, which impresses me a lot. She said that she loves travelling around Britain performing her poetry, and how her 12 year old daughter often comes along to her gigs. Most of the time this has worked well, but of course we had to compare notes on a couple of the times when taking our children to live gigs has gone spectacularly wrong...! Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones.
136. Episode 136: Steph Douglas
01:09:48||Season 14, Ep. 136Steph Douglas is a mum of three who founded the gift company Don't Buy Her Flowers ten years ago. I’m a repeat customer of the website when I want to send a friend some TLC if they don’t live round the corner. Steph explained how the idea for her company came about when she received 8 well-meant bouquets following the birth of her first child - and felt she now had something else she had to look after, as well as her newborn!Steph told me how she and her husband also had something unusually tough to contend with during her first pregnancy, as her husband Doug was diagnosed with thyroid cancer when she was just 14 weeks pregnant.I loved hearing about Steph's own childhood, growing up in a busy household of 6 children. She told me how one of her favourite periods was when most of the now grown up children had returned home after first relationships had failed, and they were all back, living and eating at home, having loads of banter, and would all go out to a club together after their parents had gone to sleep. Something she said I can maybe look forward to after my 5 have initially left home!Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones.
135. Episode 135: Ashley James
01:22:26||Season 14, Ep. 135Ashley James is a presenter and DJ who first made her name appearing briefly in Made in Chelsea. On instagram @ashleylouisejames has a huge following amongst 25-35 year old women and she frequently posts about being a mum of two little ones, and about other women's issues. Originally from the North East, you would never know that from Ashley's accent. She told me about her extraordinary school days, and very tough adolescence, after she won a scholarship to an all boys boarding school.Ashley is mum to 1 year old Ada and 3 year old Alfie and although she wasn't focused on becoming a mum, she shared with me that it's surprised her that it's something she feels really good at. We also talked about Ashley's difficult first birth and her subsequent prolapse and vaginismus. She continues to use her media presence to talk about such difficult issues as she knows it helps many other women going through similar problems.Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones.
134. Episode 134: Sister Bliss
01:12:44||Season 13, Ep. 134Ayalah Bentovim - known as Sister Bliss - is the woman behind Faithless, which she created in 1995 with Rollo Armstrong, Jamie Catto, and the legendary Buddhist rapper Maxi Jazz.Maxi died in 2022 and Ayalah talked to me about how she’s managing to keep him as part of the show, as they prepare to go on tour for the first time in 8 years.We also talked about how she took her son Nate on tour as a baby and how he adapted so brilliantly to life on the road, with Faithless. Nate has just turned 18 and Ayalah shared with me how he still keeps her grounded even if she’s about to go on stage in front of thousands of people. This is definitely something I can relate to!!Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones.
133. Episode 133: Reshmin Chowdhury
01:27:40||Season 14, Ep. 133Reshmin Chowdhury is a sports broadcaster who’s had a love of football since she was a little girl. Growing up in a large and close Bengali community, she told me her childhood memories are of being the only girl, surrounded by boys, watching football on TV. Reshmin’s drive to break into the world of sports presenting was very strong - much to the surprise of her teacher Mum and accountant Dad - and she is proud to have made it, although she feels it shouldn’t have been that hard. Her parents were very supportive of her dreams and we talked about how difficult it was losing her Dad 3 years ago, and that he was always the person she would pick up the phone to speak to after a big match. Reshmin shared how her children hold a mirror up to all her faults, including losing her temper. She says she’s working on this and I’ve asked her, when she's solved that one, please share the answer with me too! Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones.
132. Episode 132: Nine Tame
01:10:42||Season 14, Ep. 132Nina Tame is a counsellor and a content creator. I started following her on Instagram because I love the way she educates non-disabled people in a light-hearted way. Nina was born with spinal bifida, and has four children. Her third child was also born with spina bifida. His arrival helped Nina accept her own disability much more, and also helped her own mum come to terms with her complex feelings, including guilt of having a disabled child. Incidentally, I spoke to Nina when she had recently lost her mum and we talked about her difficult journey of grief and the huge support of her other half, Jase.Nina is a great storyteller and made me laugh while telling me how awkward platform lifts at theatre venues feel. But the message beneath the story was that what disables her all over again in life, is not the disability but it is inaccessibility or other people’s attitudes.Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones.
131. Episode 131: Joanne Hardcastle
01:08:27||Season 14, Ep. 131I first came to follow Joanne Hardcastle (@hardcastletowers) when she was a contestant on the fourth series of Interior Design Masters, which is one of my favourite TV shows. Joanne's husband Tim encouraged her to apply for the show and she says it was the first time she had ever put herself first, and she loves her new found 'me-time'.Joanne lost her mum at the age of 17 and had a strong urge to become a mum herself, and she has been open about having 6 miscarriages during her motherhood journey. She now has 3 grown up daughters, the youngest being her foster child. She spoke to me about the journey of building up trust with her foster daughter and how she has taught her children not to be frightened of conflict and to know that adults aren't always right.Like me, Joanne loves colour and vintage interior design, including collecting childhood treasures such as Sindy dolls. She has documented on Instagram, the intricate furnishing of an amazing dolls house which she claims not to play with... but she clearly does!Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones.