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The Lawfare Podcast

Rational Security: The “Pun Moll” Edition

This week, Alan, Quinta, and Scott were joined by their Brookings and Lawfare colleague Molly Reynolds to talk all things Congress in the week’s national security news, including:

  • Shattering the Must-Pass Ceiling.” Earlier this week, President Joe Biden and Speaker Kevin McCarthy announced a deal on raising the debt ceiling, and thereby avoiding a potential financial catastrophe. The question now is whether they can sell it to enough members of Congress, where right-wing members of McCarthy’s caucus are promising to sink it. Will the deal make it through? And if not, what might come next?
  • “Recep Tayyip Erdo-won.” After a close fought contest, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan has emerged victorious from run-offs in Türkiye’s national elections, positioning him for a third term in office and a third decade in power. Does the reelection of the increasingly autocratic figure mean the further decline of Turkish democracy? And Türkiye’s flagging relationship with the West?
  • “I’m Sorry, Dave. I’m Afraid That’s Not Regulation.” The head of several leading AI developers are actively urging Congress to regulate the industry—even as they continue to roll out new products to the public with untested capabilities. How seriously should we take this plea? And is it aimed at the right risk?


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  • Lawfare Archive: An Address by NATO's Secretary General

    01:05:41
    From March 22, 2014: On March 19, the Center on the United States and Europe (CUSE) hosted NATO Secretary-General Anders Fogh Rasmussen for a Statesman’s Forum address on the importance of the transatlantic alliance and how the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) is evolving to address new common security challenges. As the crisis in Ukraine shows that security in the Euro-Atlantic area cannot be taken for granted, the secretary-general discussed NATO’s essential role in an unpredictable world. He outlined the agenda for the September NATO summit in Wales as a critical opportunity to ensure that the alliance has the military capabilities necessary to deal with the threats it now faces, to consider how NATO members can better share the collective burden of defense and to engage constructively with partners around the world.Anders Fogh Rasmussen took office as North Atlantic Treaty Organization’s 12th secretary-general in August 2009. Previously, he served in numerous positions in the Danish government and opposition throughout his political career, including as prime minister of Denmark from November 2001 to April 2009.Brookings Senior Fellow and CUSE Director Fiona Hill provided introductory remarks and moderated the discussion.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/c/trumptrials.
  • Lawfare Daily: Trump Trials and Tribulations Weekly Round-up (July 11, 2024)

    01:23:22
    This episode of “Trump's Trials and Tribulations,” was recorded on July 11 in front of a live audience on YouTube and Zoom.Lawfare Executive Editor Natalie Orpett spoke to Lawfare Editor-in-Chief Benjamin Wittes and Lawfare Legal Correspondent and Legal Fellow Anna Bower about whether anything has happened in any of the Trump Trials and took audience questions from Lawfare material supporters.
  • Lawfare Daily: The Supreme Court Takes the Bait: Loper Bright and the Future of Chevron Deference

    51:39
    Alan Rozenshtein, Associate Professor of Law at the University of Minnesota Law School and Senior Editor at Lawfare, and Molly Reynolds, Senior Fellow at the Brookings Institution and Senior Editor at Lawfare, spoke with Bridget Dooling, Assistant Professor of Law at The Ohio State University Moritz College of Law, and Nick Bednar, Associate Professor of Law at the University of Minnesota Law School, about the Supreme Court's recent decision in Loper Bright Enterprises v. Raimondo, which overruled the decades-long Chevron doctrine that required courts to defer to reasonable interpretations of their statutes.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/c/trumptrials.
  • Rational Security: The “Pétanque-a-Donk” Edition

    01:11:59
    This week, Quinta and Scott were joined by Lawfare Managing Editor Tyler McBrien and Lawfare Contributing Editor Eric Ciaramella to talk over all the national security news causing traffic issues in D.C., including:“Ukraine in the Membrane.” NATO is hosting its 75th anniversary summit here in Washington, D.C., this week. But its members’ eyes are uniformly locked on Ukraine, whose (eventual) membership several will voice support for this week—even as others worry about what a future Trump administration might mean for the alliance and its commitment to the ongoing conflict there. What trajectory is NATO headed on? And what should the alliance be doing to prepare?“So Gauche.” Left political movements emerged victorious over populist right-wing movements in two major elections in Europe this past week. In France, the left-wing New Popular Front squeaked out a narrow plurality over President Emmanuel Macron’s centrist coalition and the right-wing National Rally. And in the U.K., a resurgent Labour movement finally ended fourteen years of increasingly unpopular Conservative control. What do these results tell us about political trends in Europe? And can they shed any light on what the United States might experience in its own election later this year?“Hindsight is 20/25.” This week, former President Donald Trump tried to distance himself from Project 2025, denying any awareness of the Heritage Foundation-led project that has produced a 900-page book of policy proposals for the potentially returning conservative president—even though several of his former advisers contributed to the project and a number of its proposals seem to be included in the platform that Republican Party leaders adopted this week. How does this agenda compare to what the Trump administration pursued in its first term? And what role is it likely to play if Trump does return to the White House?For object lessons, Quinta recommended James McBride's latest book, “The Heaven & Earth Grocery Store.” Scott highlighted two great pieces on the continuing relevance of the classic movie “Chinatown,” in light of both its 50th anniversary and the death of its author Robert Towne—and urged director David Fincher to keep at his plans to produce a prequel series for Netflix. Tyler shared the earnest welcome to the NATO summit produced by D.C.'s own wholesome influencer, Tony P. And Eric expressed his passion for the great Finnish pastime of hobby horsing.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/c/trumptrials.
  • Lawfare Daily: What China Thinks of Military AI with Sam Bresnick

    36:38
    Many Pentagon officials and U.S. lawmakers likely lay awake at night wondering what Chinese leaders think about the use of artificial intelligence in war.  On today’s episode, Sam Bresnick, a Research Fellow at Georgetown’s Center for Security and Emerging Technology joins Lawfare Managing Editor Tyler McBrien to begin to answer that very question and discuss his new report, “China’s Military AI Roadblocks: PRC Perspectives on Technological Challenges to Intelligentized Warfare.”They discuss how Sam found and analyzed dozens of Chinese-language journal articles about AI and warfare, Beijing’s hopes for these new and emerging technologies, and what, in turn, keeps Chinese defense officials up at night as well.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/c/trumptrials.
  • Lawfare Daily: Scott Singer on AI and U.S.-China Relations

    40:42
    Scott Singer, Co-Founder and Director of the Oxford China Policy Lab, joins Kevin Frazier, a Tarbell Fellow at Lawfare, to discuss AI in the context of ongoing and, arguably, increasing tensions between China and the U.S. This conversation covers potential limits on China’s AI ambitions, the durability of the current bipartisan consensus among U.S. officials on the China question, and the factors that may accelerate the race to artificial general intelligence between China and the U.S.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/c/trumptrials.
  • Chatter: The Largest Sting Operation of All Time with Joseph Cox

    01:21:18
    Joseph Cox is an award-winning investigative journalist and the co-founder of 404 Media. He is also the world’s leading reporter on the FBI's Anom sting operation, a topic he has written about in the new book, Dark Wire: The Incredbile True Story of the Largest Sting Operation Ever.Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced and edited by Noam Osband of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad.See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.
  • Lawfare Daily: Christopher Kirchhoff on How the Pentagon and Silicon Valley Are Transforming the Future of War

    58:33
    Jack Goldsmith sat down with Christopher Kirchhoff, a former senior official in the Pentagon’s Defense Innovation Unit (DIU) and the co-author with Raj Shah of the new book, “Unit X: How the Pentagon and Silicon Valley Are Transforming the Future of War.” They talked about the origins and aims of the Defense Innovation Unit, how the defense bureaucracy fought it, and DIU’s successes and failures. They also discussed the pathologies of defense procurement, the relationship between technological innovation and military superiority, and whether the Department of Defense can innovate fast enough to maintain technological and military superiority.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/c/trumptrials.
  • Lawfare Daily: Chinny Sharma and Yonathan Arbel on the Promises and Perils of Open-Source AI

    52:03
    Chinny Sharma, Associate Professor at Fordham Law School, and Yonathan Arbel, co-director of the Center for Law and AI Risk and Associate Professor of Law at Alabama Law, join Kevin Frazier, a Tarbell Fellow at Lawfare, to discuss open-source AI. This engaging conversation dives into the origins of open source, its meaning in the AI context, and why attempts to regulate open-source AI have drawn passionate responses from across the AI community.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/c/trumptrials.