Share

cover art for Chatter: The People Side of Intelligence with Darrell Blocker

The Lawfare Podcast

Chatter: The People Side of Intelligence with Darrell Blocker

Darrell Blocker retired from the Central Intelligence Agency in 2018 after serving as an operations officer and manager in many countries, especially within Africa. His self-described lack of success recruiting assets during early assignments nevertheless taught him important lessons about the intelligence business, about how people work, and about himself; later tours of duty gave him the chance to make up for lost time by excelling at the job while also getting shot at and even gaining minor fame as the lead singer in an African jazz band. Blocker left CIA service as one of the most senior black officers in the Agency's history—and he was reportedly on President Biden's shortlist to become the director of the CIA. Now, he's involved in several creative projects in Hollywood.

On this episode of Chatter, David Priess chatted with Blocker about his career and his activities since retirement. They discussed getting spy stories told on film, growing up as an Air Force brat, understanding the Pledge of Allegiance, stumbling early in an intelligence career, appreciating the operational environment in Africa, growing from mistakes, accepting lessons from 360-degree feedback, performing on stage in a jazz band, singing the national anthem, being considered as a CIA director, enhancing the CIA's interactions with the media, learning about the benefits of fictional representations of Hollywood's take on intelligence, and more.

Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was produced by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad.

More episodes

View all episodes

  • Lawfare Daily: Dockets Die in Darkness with Peter Beck and Seamus Hughes

    32:58|
    In his recent piece for Court Watch, a news site covering interesting, yet often overlooked federal court filings, Lawfare Associate Editor Peter Beck wrote about the Middle District of Georgia, which is “filled with rich news stories that even a few years ago would have been quickly reported” but which “now sits in a so-called ‘news desert,’ a place that is largely devoid of even a single newspaper, let alone a reporter dedicated to its federal court.” Out of Georgia’s 17 counties without a single local news source, 12 fall within the Middle District of Georgia’s jurisdiction. Unfortunately, this district is not alone in this regard, writes Beck, but rather “part of a broader trend of the death of local news, leaving community members uninformed about important developments in their neighborhoods and leading to less and less transparency in the legal system.”For today’s episode, Lawfare Managing Editor Tyler McBrien sits down with Beck, as well as Seamus Hughes, a senior research faculty at the University of Nebraska Omaha’s National Counterterrorism Innovation, Technology, and Education Center (NCITE) and the founder of Court Watch, to discuss what happens when “dockets die in darkness.”To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.
  • Lawfare Daily: What To Expect on the Immigration Front in Year 2 of Trump's Second Term

    52:42|
    Lawfare Senior Editor Eric Columbus talks with Aaron Reichlin-Melnick of the American Immigration Council to discuss what is—and isn’t—likely to look different in the upcoming year of Trump administration immigration policy. After a whirlwind year, ICE and CBP have a lot more resources than at the dawn of the administration—but also a lot more opposition. How will it all shake out? To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.
  • Lawfare Daily: The Trials of the Trump Administration, Feb. 6

    01:25:04|
    In a live conversation on YouTube, Lawfare Executive Editor Natalie Orpett sat down with Lawfare Senior Editors Eric Columbus, Roger Parloff, and Molly Roberts to discuss a congressional hearing into ICE’s use of force in Minneapolis and Chicago, oral argument over DHS’s mandatory detention policy, a district judge rejecting Minnesota’s 10th amendment challenge to Operation Metro Surge, and more.You can find information on legal challenges to Trump administration actions here. And check out Lawfare’s new homepage on the litigation, new Bluesky account, and new WITOAD merch.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.
  • Lawfare Archive: Asylum-Seekers and the EU Migration Pact

    55:15|
    From April 1, 2024: In early February, the European Union approved a major overhaul of its immigration laws. If approved by EU member states, the pact will drastically curtail the rights of migrants and asylum seekers entering the European Union. It’s part of a trend we’re seeing all over the world, including here in the U.S.  Lawfare Executive Editor Natalie Orpett sat down with Steve Meili, Professor of International Human Rights Law at University of Minnesota Law School. They discussed the EU Pact’s new provisions, why critics are calling them a violation of human rights law, and how asylum and migration law is evolving globally. To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.
  • Lawfare Archive: Anna Bower on Judge McBurney’s Deliberations

    42:34|
    From January 25, 2023: Judge Robert McBurney of the Superior Court of Fulton County held a hearing on Tuesday to decide whether or not to release the Fulton County Special Grand Jury's report on 2020 election interference in Georgia. Lawfare's Fulton County correspondent Anna Bower was in the room live-blogging the matter, and Lawfare editor-in-chief Benjamin Wittes caught up with her right after the hearing to talk it through. Why did the district attorney argue that the report should continue to be sealed for now? What were the media organizations’ arguments, and which way was Judge McBurney leaning? Is the report going to become public? And if so, when? To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.
  • Lawfare Daily: Iran Protests and Internet Shutdown

    47:52|
    Information about the recent protests in Iran and the regime's brutal crackdown are only starting to come to light, having been severely limited by the internet shutdown over the past few weeks. The picture that is emerging is horrifying: Thousands and possibly tens of thousands have been killed by regime security forces. In this episode, Lawfare Public Service Fellow Ariane Tabatabai talks to Nate Swanson and Iria Puyosa of the Atlantic Council to make sense of what has been going on in Iran and the U.S. response.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.
  • Rational Security: “The Story of Three Warrants” Edition

    01:22:51|
    This week, Scott sat down with his Lawfare colleagues Molly Roberts, Michael Feinberg, and Troy Edwards to talk through the week’s big warrant-related national security news, including:“Tulsi Went Down to Georgia, She Was Looking for a Vote to Steal.” This past week, the FBI executed a warrant to search Fulton County’s election center for ballots and equipment related to the 2020 election, with the help of an unlikely senior administration official: Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard, who was reportedly there in-person at the order of President Trump. Observers are concerned that the search is the beginning of a broader effort to relitigate the 2020 election—especially as Trump calls for Republicans in Congress to “nationalize elections” in advance of the November mid-terms. What do we know about the legal basis for this search? And what does it tell us about what the Trump administration has planned for November?“I Hear the Jury’s Still Out on the Fourth Amendment.” Over the past week, whistleblowers have revealed that ICE has issued a series of internal memos to agents advising that they do not need judicial warrants to detain or search the homes of people suspected of being undocumented immigrants. Instead, ICE has attempted to side-step the regular judicial process by suggesting that agents only need an administrative warrant, a controversial move that will almost certainly be challenged in court. What do we think of ICE’s decision to shift to such a legally dubious policy, and where do we expect it to go from here?“Ex Post Justification.” Last month, the FBI conducted a search on the home of Washington Post reporter Hannah Natanson as part of an investigation into alleged leaks by a Defense Department contractor. During the search, agents seized Natanson’s personal and professional devices, which drew concern from media outlets and civil liberty groups over potential First Amendment and privacy violations. A magistrate judge has now ordered that the FBI cannot access Natanson’s materials at least for now, while some of these issues are litigated. How should federal law enforcement balance the need to conduct leak investigations with press freedoms? And is this case on the right side of the line?In object lessons, sometimes all you can do is cry: Molly is remembering better days for the Washington Post and mourning the fall of a once-great paper. Sometimes all you can do is get lost in the music: Mike is celebrating the still-great Miles Davis with the long-awaited release of The Complete Miles Davis Live at the Plugged Nickel 1965 on vinyl. Sometimes all you can do is laugh: Scott is delighting in his former State Department colleague’s new Substack, Ridiculocracy. And sometimes, all you can do is wear something fabulous: Troy is modeling the new wardrobe must-have for the “Government in Exile.”To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.
  • Lawfare Daily: The U.S. Plan for Venezuelan Oil Revenue

    01:03:56|
    On today's podcast, Executive Editor Natalie Orpett speaks with Lawfare Senior Editor Scott R. Anderson about the recently announced U.S. plan to take possession of Venezuelan oil, sell it on the world market, and hold the revenue from those sales in accounts based in Qatar. Scott and Lawfare Contributing Editor Alex Zerden recently published an article in Lawfare digging into the complexities of the plan. Scott and Natalie talk through them all—what exactly this plan is, how it’s supposed to work, why Qatar is involved, and all the many challenges in play.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.
  • Lawfare Daily: Unearthing and Reckoning with the Intelligence Excesses of the Cold War

    55:46|
    Lawfare Senior Editor Michael Feinberg sits down with Matthew Guariglia and Brian Hochman to discuss their new book, “The Church Committee ReportRevelations from the Bombshell 1970s Investigation into the National Security State,” in which they chronicle the law enforcement and intelligence community’s Cold War excesses, the Senate committee which uncovered them, and what we can learn about the resulting report in terms of our own era.To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.