Frank and Stan Chats

This week, the Frank and Stan Chat is delighted to have Mark Phillips, a former HMI with expertise in music education, rejoin us after a highly enjoyable and well received guest appearance last year. Stan gets things moving by reflecting on the recent ITV documentary 7Up. He considers how many significant life changes and developments take place between the ages of 7 and 21 and how they play out in later life. Mark then considers the difference between knowledge of music and participation in music. He explains why engagement is so important and why some schools struggle to create a high-quality music experience for pupils. Frank then draws on some recent social media covering the OECD PISA results. He reads an X message from Prof Andy Hargreaves's (a frequent guest on the chat), where he explains why we need to 'get a grip on these bigger issues, together, and stop rearranging the nationalistic deckchairs on the glocal Titanic'.We also explain how we are going to manage the second Live Edition of the Frank and Stan Chat in Cheshire on Thursday. It's going to be an interesting ride.Enjoy.

Frank has known Mick for close on 20 years and had been keen to invite him to be a guest on the chat. He's a major figure in education, bringing a wealth of varied experience aligned with a strong academic background. His collaboration with Tim Brighouse, 'About our schools; Improving on previous best' is a seminal book. In this chat he doesn't disappoint. Stan opens the conversation, considering the difficulty (or not) of GCSE mathematics and why progress appears to slow in secondary schools. Mick then explains why he is such a strong supporter of 'The Open School' movement. Frank then considers why truth matters and why a strong ethical approach to leadership is essential for being honest with those being served and those being led. It was a privilege spending 40 minutes chatting with an education colossus. Enjoy. We certainly did.

The Frank and Stan Chat which covers Education and Leadership issues, is back for its seventh academic year. Who said it wouldn't last?Frank and Stan Chat feel privileged to have Dennis Sherwood as a guest. His career includes reading physics at Clare College, Cambridge, followed by an MPhil at the Department of Molecular Biophysics and Biochemistry at Yale University, and a PhD in biology at the University of California, San Diego. Dennis is a Sloan Fellow, with distinction, of London Business School. He joined Deloitte Haskins + Sells as a trainee IT consultant, and spent 18 years. For 12 of those years, he was a consulting partner, pioneering business and financial modelling, and founded a centre of excellence in the use of mathematics and statistics in business. He then became an Executive Director with Goldman Sachs, taking up the role of Head of Management Controls (Europe), responsible for internal audit and internal consulting in London, Paris, Frankfurt, Zurich and Milan. Subsequently, Dennis was appointed Managing Director of the UK operations of SRI Consulting. Dennis is an accomplished public speaker, and has appeared on the platform of many conferences; he has written many articles, for journals such as London Business School's Business Strategy Review, Management Today, Accountancy and Accountancy Age. He is also the author of fifteen books, including Unlock Your Mind, Smart Things to Know about Innovation and Creativity, Creating an Innovative Culture, Seeing the Forest for the Trees, Creativity for Scientists and Engineers, Strategic Thinking Illustrated - Strategy made visual using systems thinking, and 'Missing the Mark' Why so many school exam grades are wrong, and how to get results we can trust. For those who have followed our chat over the past few years, you will know that we always invite Dennis to join us in early September to take stock of the examination results period. Dennis managed to secure an extensive recent Observer piece about the vagaries of the examination system, making clear why so many grades awarded are wrong. He was also interviewed by Sky News recently. This chat covers much of this but also considers why a third of students feel they have failed their secondary education and the back story to the recent news that a headteacher of a small primary school who recently underwent surgery for cancer had a deferral refused by Ofsted.

Frank and Stan reflect on some recent announcements by the new Prime Minister and the new Secretary of State for Education on vocational and technical education. We then get into the main part of this mid-summer break chat with Dame Kathy August and Tom Clark CBE. Over the past 20 years, education has undergone significant changes. The movement from maintained schools run by local authorities to an academy trust arrangement has been one of the most significant. During that period, governments have come and gone, but the legacy of prominent education figures who helped fashion that innovation has remained. Kathy and Tom were engaged in that work from different perspectives. They have joined forces to co-author an amazing new book called 'Voices from the education vanguard'. They interviewed just over 40 prominent education figures including, Lord Michael Gove, David Laws, Sam Freedman, Sir David Bell, Sir Michael Wilshaw, Sir Nick Gibb, Lord Ken Baker and many others to better understand their motivation for reform, what appeared to work well and their regrets, if any. The discussions are condensed into 3 or 4 pages, focusing on major issues. The second half of the book considers three themes that emanated from the discussions. These cover Culture, Governance and Architecture. We highly recommend this book. The quality of this chat gives an insight into what you get when you read their book. Enjoy.

The joy of our weekly chats lies in the contributions made by our amazing guests. This week is no exception as we are joined by a former HMI, Mathematics subject lead and specialist adviser, Steve Wren. Steve has been keeping a keen eye on Ofsted's new inspection framework and has shared his insights on social media. Today he focuses on the problems around attendance and behaviour. Stan gets things rolling by considering how compliant schools and their leaders are, even when there is much to be disgruntled by. He considers what would happen if a school didn't go out of its way to work openly with inspectors. Frank closes the chat with his growing dislike of SUV drivers parking on yellow lines so that their children can avoid a two-minute walk to school. He also draws attention to two headteachers who regularly call this action out despite it not being in their job description.It's a belting chat. Enjoy, we believe you will!

The SPOTLIGHT editions of the Frank and Stan Chat provide us with a chance to meet colleagues with one topic of conversation. The 30th edition is with Sian Hampton and Alice Gregson. They have created a System Leadership programme that is focused on a range of partners delivering services for children and families. It brings educators together with those from health, social care, housing and other partners to consider how jointly they can contribute more if they are better coordinated. The chat considers how previous attempts have been marginally successful and what is currently being attempted. Sian and Alice get a chance to chat about their new programme. If you are interested this is the weblink you will need. https://elevatingleadership.co.uk/programmes/Enjoy.

It is always a joy to have John Malynn back as a guest on the chat. He is the only senior civil servant we know of to lead on accountability for the DfE, including its relationship with Ofsted, and also be invited to join the inspectorate as a key policy adviser. A rather unique set of experiences.With so much happening in politics this week we focus on the important work of the Education Select Committee and their meeting with Sir Martyn Oliver on Tuesday. Before we get into that ,Stan considers what he gained from a restful week in Spain and how it influenced his thinking on the drive for better attendance. John then considers a host of DfE announcements, why they were made and who will monitor their introduction. Frank then considers how the Chief Inspector wanted to focus on provision rather than outcomes in considering how effective Ofsted is in managing staff wellbeing.It's a lively and lengthy chat but please stick with it cos there are some interesting insights in how government works and how the relationship with the inspectorate has changed over time.Enjoy

It was a pleasure to welcome Jill Munday to the Frank and Stan Chat. Jill has had a varied and interesting career and met Frank when they were Assistant Divisional Managers working on local authority inspections with Ofsted. Since retiring Jill has been a passionate supporter of The Malagiri School in Nepal. This Spotlight chat covers how she got involved, how she currently supports their work and what she has gained from the experience. She’s visiting the school again in November. It is a fascinating chat and enables us to consider the lessons for English education at a time of challenge and change. If you would like to donate to the school, there is a link on their website www. https://malagirischool.uk