Share
Democracy Sausage with Mark Kenny
Political prisoners
Economics professor, Sean Turnell, and writer and surgeon, Ma Thida, join us to discuss their experiences as political prisoners and their hopes for Myanmar’s future.
Sean Turnell and Ma Thida have both experienced the terror of being locked up in Myanmar. So how did they survive? What do they think were Daw Aung San Suu Kyi’s missteps during leadership and prior to the 2021 military coup? And how hopeful are they that democracy may return to Myanmar?
On this episode of Democracy Sausage, previous political prisoners, Sean Turnell and Ma Thida, join Professor Mark Kenny to discuss imprisonment, democratisation and the future of Myanmar.
Sean Turnell is an Honorary Professor of Economics at Macquarie University. He has been a Senior Economic Analyst at the Reserve Bank of Australia, a policy adviser for institutions such as the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank. He served as the senior economic adviser to Myanmar’s government led by Daw Aung San Suu Kyi, and was imprisoned for 650 days after the 2021 military coup.
Ma Thida is a Burmese human rights activist, surgeon and writer. She was imprisoned for six years in Insein prison in the 1990s for her pro-democracy activism. Currently, she is the chair of PEN International Writers in Prison committee.
Mark Kenny is the Director of the ANU Australian Studies Institute. He came to the University after a high-profile journalistic career including six years as chief political correspondent and national affairs editor for The Sydney Morning Herald, The Age and The Canberra Times.
Democracy Sausage with Mark Kenny is available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pocket Casts, Google Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. We’d love to hear your feedback on this series, so send in your questions, comments or suggestions for future episodes to democracysausage@anu.edu.au.
This podcast is produced by The Australian National University.
More episodes
View all episodes
Antidote to the far right
46:25|Is the collapse in trust of Australia's institutions, the retreat of unionism from everyday working life, and the alliances forged in Victoria's Covid lockdowns and reactivated by the 2023 Voice referendum responsible for the rise of the far right? Is One Nation's surge a passing spike, or the tail end of a forty-year rupture in Australian political life? Could a revived, class-based union movement win back the "recent defectors" drifting from Labor to Pauline Hanson before it's too late?This week, Mark and Marija are joined by Oscar Kaspi-Crutchett, research organiser at the Victorian Trades Hall Council and author of the new report Antidote.Angertainment
52:18|Is social media now a more powerful force reshaping Australian democracy than any politician, party, or policy? Why has Pauline Hanson spent thirty years in the political wilderness only to emerge as the country's most potent electoral force in 2026? Can the anger-entertainment industrial complex explain everything from One Nation's surge to the Voice referendum's collapse — and if rage bait is more engaging than porn, what hope does civility, truth, and evidence have in the modern political arena? Ed Coper, author of Angertainment, joins Mark and Marija to unpack how social media algorithms have weaponised our ancient neurochemistry, why the internet's promise of a global village became a gladiatorial arena, and whether anyone can still win politics by appealing to hope.Two Teals, One Ticket
43:19|Have Zali Steggall and Allegra Spender just become the party they always swore they weren't? Can a "free vote" constitution and no party room really survive contact with a Senate seat? Does the donation and spending caps from the last parliament leave community independents with no real choice but to collectivise? And what happens to "putting community first" the moment a hung parliament forces a deal? Zali Steggall and Allegra Spender join Mark and Marija from Parliament House to discuss the launch of Community Strong Australia, the logic (and the irony) behind it, and whether teal voters will buy a party that insists it isn't one.Broken Britain and the Burnham Moment
01:02:12|How did a Prime Minister who won one of the largest parliamentary majorities in British history find himself gone within two years — and what does his fate tell us about the limits of triangulation politics? Is Andy Burnham's victory a genuine realignment moment for British Labour, or is he inheriting a structurally broken state where no leader can succeed? With Reform UK on the march and the North-South divide wider than the gap between East and West Germany, can Burnham's vision of devolution, constitutional reform and a written constitution offer a way out — and what can Australian politics learn from Britain's decade of revolving-door prime ministers?Political scientist Pat Leslie joins Mark and Maria to make sense of the collapse of the Starmer government and the rise of Andy Burnham.Race for the base
53:25|How long will the honeymoon last for One Nation? Can Pauline Hanson create a robust political party to be competitive at the next election? How do populist leaders like Trump, Farage, and Hanson convince the working class that their wealthy backers back them? With One Nation rising in the polls, Special Correspondent at the Saturday Paper, Jason Koutsoukis joins Mark and Marija to discuss the threats to Labor and the Liberals and what they need to do to arrest the decline in the polls.Contest for the populist vote
52:49|Does the experience in the US, Germany, and Brazil reflect the Australian experience? How have institutional structures insulated centrist parties against new political threats? Can the rise of anger captured by the populists be effectively tested, and has Mayor of New York, Zohran Mamdani shown the way? Dr Rüçhan Kaya joins Mark and Marija to discuss the drift towards populism and nationalism in liberal democratic countries.China in the world
38:14|Can Australia manage the tensions between our strategic relationship with China and the alliance with the United States? Does membership of AUKUS and the Quad damage our China relationship? How significantly are societal and economic issues - such as the role of women in decision making, aging population, corruption and the household registration system - impacting cohesion?China expert, Graeme Smith joins Mark to discuss China, and our relationship.A Democracy Sausage for the Teacher
01:14:37|Have young voters lost faith in the major political parties and politics in general? Did the recent federal budget go far enough in addressing the generational wealth gap and what will it take for political parties to successfully engage young voters?In this special classroom edition of Democracy Sausage, Dr Jill Sheppard joins the DS team and heads back to school (literally) to discuss the growing distrust in politics amongst young voters.Budget, Smudge-it: truth, details and the aspiration wars
57:34|Will the budget changes reconnect young and disaffected Australians to the benefits of the economy? Is Angus Taylor’s vision likely to arrest the decline in support to One Nation? Is the ALP open to creating a sovereign wealth fund as outlined by Pauline Hanson? Treasurer of Australia, Dr Jim Chalmers joins Marija and Mark to discuss last week’s budget, Angus Taylors’ reply and the challenges of ‘getting it right’ in today’s volatile political and economic landscape.