Our Friendly World with Fawn and Matt

Breaking the Sound Barrier with Michael Joly On this episode we explore sound and how it changes and connects us; how to hear, listen and distinguish the truth in our hearts and souls. We also have a three minute Tone Therapy session with the use of Michael's invention: the N.O.W. sound device which when you listen for 3 minutes and 20 seconds has the similar outcome of a long meditation. Wise words from this podcast: Michael Joly: “All forms arise from no form.” “Having a fog experience like that, can kind of bring us back to this primordial pre-formed time. And I think that's part of what we're recognizing in a fog experience; is it's not quite in form yet.” “…the Holy Spirit doesn't speak first nor the loudest. “ “…sitting in stillness and allowing stillness and allowing spaciousness allows thus, still small, very quiet, inspired thoughts to arise.” “I realized that when I followed sound so intensely like that in the context of my job as an audio engineer, in the context of, of, you know, designing products and, uh, and listening to them, , that I found, I found I could not be thinking at the same time as I, as listening, if I was truly bringing and intentional attention to listening, right. I could not be thinking at the same time. And then only years later, did I say, Whoa, wait a minute. That sort of matches up with some of the check boxes of what meditation is and intentional unintentional, unintentional nonjudgmental focus on the present moment.” “Let's bundle up all the lies and turn our backs to them. Turn our backs to that profanity and inhabit truth and see how that feels.”   “…this is another type of mindfulness practice that you have to have an intention. You have to willfully use your attention…combining the word attention with an, a, an intention. You have to have an intention to listen attentively and to direct your attention.” “A shift in focus as an aid; these are aids; to give the mind another form object to alight upon, and doing that intentionally.” Fawn: “Where the magic happens is in the space of the unknown… everything manifests within that space of nothingness where it's not formed yet.”   Transcript: Breaking the Sound Barrier Episode 37 with Michael Joly [00:00:00] Track 1: [00:00:00] We're an interracial couple with two kids wanting to do something that highlights the power of friendship and what it means to be in the company of true friends. We're going to move our society away and out of the loneliness epidemic and into a friendlier, happier world. Welcome to our friendly world. Better, stronger, together. fawn: [00:00:42] Good morning. Good afternoon. Hello. Hello. You know the sound of the ocean, the sound of ocean waves. I'm getting right into at first negative wisdom from Santa Monica. This time. [00:01:00] It's the sounds that I heard from Santa Monica. That was my lesson. I, as a small child, as you guys know, I talk about. My mentor, Santa Monica all the time. But as a child, now that I'm looking back on, it makes sense. One of the reasons I felt so calm and taken care of, I think it was the sound of the ocean waves. What is it about that? It's, it's like, it's like the sound of. Shh. Like, I don't know how that came across the microphone, but you know, when we had our babies and the doctors would say, uh, that's sound calms them, um, on an extreme level, they would say even the sound of a vacuum cleaner calms them. And I'm like, why? That is ridiculous. And they would say it, it could be the sound [00:02:00] of. Just being in utero. Right. All the, all the pipes going, I guess. I don't know how you describe it, but you know, the sounds of water you're in water. Right. And so the sounds of the waves, I guess it's kind of like, it reminds you of a breath coming in and going out deep breath in. Deep breath out, Matt, why are you looking at me like that? Stop it. Do you not understand what I'm saying? No, I do. I do ocean. It, it is life. It teaches you so much. Just sitting there, the waves come in the waves, go out and it's so powerful. Even if you're just there with your. Toes in the water, like barely the water reaches your, your ankles, but you feel like your entire body will get sucked into the deep, deep ocean. When the, when the tide goes out, when [00:03:00] the water goes back out, it's a huge port. Very powerful, much like the sound. It just made me, it was like a mother, a kind loving mother or a parent shushing me. And saying it's okay. Shushing in a good way. Don't laugh. No, no, no, no. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Go ahead. And so today I want to talk about, I call it breaking the sound barrier, and I want to talk about communication and I wanted to talk about tone and sound. I'm now addicted to looking things up. Let me see tone. Let's look it up. Noun, a musical or vocal sound with reference to its pitch quality and strength to the general character or attitude of a place. Piece of writing situation, et cetera, much like you, Matt, you will say something to me. And I will say, [00:04:00] I don't appreciate your tone and you don't, you don't understand. And you, we get into a fight over tone because you didn't feel like you express yourself a certain way. But to me it was a horrible. Tone, but you don't, you don't hear it, but I heard it, you know? Matt: [00:04:17] Right. Because I understand the intent behind it, but you hear only what is said. fawn: [00:04:23] I hear a nasty tone, not what you said, but like a mean tone sometimes. Right? And it makes a difference, like, even with email, right? You always say you can never hear tone in an email. Right. You don't know, it may sound nasty. But the person may have not had that intention. Right. The other way around right. Tone is a big deal. Okay. So the definition continues. A tone is the kind of sound you hear in a musical note or in a person's voice live or in writing. Look at that. So [00:05:00] example, when Al was born, I did not read to her goodnight moon. I read to her the journals from Bruce Lee. The different ways to strike a person, right? And then there's this other book that we have on all his athletic feats and his day to day his journal on how to work out. And that's what I would read to. And she would go to sleep like that because the tone, it was about the tone. And I remember a long time ago when I was a kid, I loved black and white movies and there was this really old movie back in the day when people were hats and gloves. And there was a guy who was reading the newspaper to this newborn and he was reading the races, like, you know, how they would bet on horse races and that's what he read. And I think that's when tone really came into my existence. Like, wow, look at that. You can read something like that and make it sound like a lullaby. It's all about tone and intention, [00:06:00] right? Matt? Matt: [00:06:02] Yes. Abs no, no, no, no. Yes, absolutely. I totally get that. As a matter of fact. Yeah, just this past week, I rediscovered a musical artist who redoes actually songs and I listened to some of them and one of their remakes, it completely using the exact same words, completely changes. The tone of the song changes the, the meaning of the song, even just by changing how it's performed. fawn: [00:06:29] Exactly. And bear with me because this will really come down to. Our friend, by the way, welcome to our friendly world. Um, by the way, I forgot to introduce us, but you know, that is key. That is one of the keys with friendship with creating a friendlier world is to really. Hear each other properly and to understand the undercurrents or the forces that you don't see, even with sound with the forces that you don't hear, but you feel I'm [00:07:00] almost done with the definitions. Here we go. Um, so where does tone come from? So, um, Really into the ETA model. Thank you, Anna model. Matt: [00:07:11] That's a mythology. Continue to the next fawn: [00:07:13] word derive the right now I can't talk at all. Derived from tennis. I hope I'm pronouncing that right. Okay. Some Greek is about to come in. Do you know that, uh, it's uh, it's derived from tennis and the tension of the string of an arrow bow and the noise that was produced when the arrow was shot that. So that's what tone that's where tone comes Matt: [00:07:40] from. Did you know that I can, I can totally feel that. fawn: [00:07:43] And then I looked up like, what is sound? It's a sensation produced through the ears late 13th century from old French. S O N soul sound musical notes, voice from [00:08:00] Latin. So news sound annoys. The atomology of sound is derived from the Anglo-Saxon or old Norse word Sund. Again, I apologize for my pronunciation, which also means swimming. Did you know that the word sun S U N D is documented and old Norse and old English as meaning gap or narrow access and geography of sound as a large sea or ocean and let deeper than a bright and wider than a Fjord or a narrow sea or ocean channel between two bodies of land. That's interesting because sound is like the vibration and the land is in fact, us, do you know where I'm getting at? Like we are the land, the [00:09:00] water, the sound it's I, I take it as a direct correlation to our connections as human beings. The sound, the water, the actual sound, the land. You know, the, the interplay, why are you looking at me? Track 2: [00:09:14] Like Matt: [00:09:14] I gotta stop looking at you. Why Omar? Well, no, I'm thinking I'm just, I'm drawing my own, like connections and inferences, but yeah, go ahead. Okay. fawn: [00:09:22] Your eyes are scanning. Awful. Look. All right. So here's where our super friend comes in. Michael Dolly is here, everyone. Please meet Michael, Michael, please talk to us because you are the expert. You, you bring in the metaphysics, you bring in sound listening consciousness. You're an inventor. I would say a scientist. You've you've invented this amazing now. These discs that for three minutes, give you [00:10:00] a heightened state of meditation. I feel, um, I just got these in the mail recently. We, we are so excited. It's making our house completely buzz and vibrate in such a beautiful way. And it takes me right back. To the ocean, which, you know, Matt, I miss so much because somehow we're living in the middle of the continent and I feel like ship, not a ship. I feel like a fish out of water. Like I am, I can't breathe. I need, I need a water anyway, Michael, I'm sorry. Matt: [00:10:33] Michael. Welcome. Hello. Welcome fawn: [00:10:35] to our friendly world's Michael. Michael: [00:10:38] Good morning. Good morning. It's a very friendly reminiscence of Santa Monica. And the ocean also, thank you for setting up my entry with some sound memories. fawn: [00:10:50] Thank you so much for being here. We've been wanting to talk to you and we, we friends, we scheduled a little meeting beforehand and Matt [00:11:00] refuse to talk to Michael because I know so through. Okay. So. Michael. I met my goal last week at a convention or this week, I don't remember. And through Michael, we met Barry who we interviewed a few days ago. We had such a great time. I was talking to Barry and Barry was saying w such amazing things about Michael, which I already sensed anyway, because as soon as I heard Michael speak at this convention, I was blown away one by his beautiful voice. But by the way, this man speaks, he is an exceptional human being, I think. Michael: [00:11:40] That's a pretty, you know, you're making a pretty high bar fawn: [00:11:43] there. I'm sorry. But I think you guys are actually Michael: [00:11:46] like aspire to all of that. Let me, let me put it that way. fawn: [00:11:50] I think you guys are best friends. And so Matt didn't want to talk to Michael because he wanted to keep it fresh for this, for this, for this episode. [00:12:00] But I'm going to let you guys talk. Now Matt: [00:12:04] what she's referring to is just, I started like riffing and that's what happens when I connect with some people is all of a sudden it kind of generates. Different and new and glorious thoughts and, and attempting to re kind of invent that, or have a, have that conversation over again can be problematic. So, yes, let's start from the Michael: [00:12:24] top. You want to have a conversation in the now? Matt: [00:12:27] Exactly. All. That's cute in the now you fawn: [00:12:33] guys, these, the no, these discs are called the now. These what we'll get into at you, and we're going to have them in the show notes. When you guys go to the show notes, you can totally hear the experience. Three minutes of tone meditation. Michael will describe a better, of course. Uh, Michael, can we start from the beginning? Can you tell us all about yourself? How did this start? How did you get into sound? Who are you? Tell [00:13:00] us everything. Welcome. Welcome. Michael: [00:13:03] Well, thank you. Uh, thank you for the invitation Fawn and Matt. It's lovely to be here. I'm speaking to you from Tampa. It's East coast time here at this moment. I love these images of the description of tone and also sound and waves and water. Let's see. Yeah, I came here from, uh, from the Island of Martha's vineyard off the coast of Cape Cod separated. The two are separated by Nantucket sound Heyo. Uh, I would take a ferry boat back and forth a few times a week to go from the Island to the mainland Cape and, uh, ferry boats. These very bows had a twin engines and the two engines would come in and out of sync, uh, with their, their sort of th the throbbing of the. Diesel moaners. So you'd get these pulsing and, you know, you get this horrible blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. [00:14:00] And, uh, so those low frequency pulsations can really move you into a meditative state because that kind of amplitude pulsation in that frequency range helps. Set up what we would call an entrainment, a brainwave entrainment situation, where the brain recognizes those low frequency sounds as being something that's pleasant. The kind of, it's the kind of, um, it's the kind of brain waves that are generated when you are in an open monitoring meditation, uh, or you're, um, sort of gazing out onto the mid distance across the ocean. You'll find that you have more brainwaves in the lower frequency range, alpha brainwaves, Delta brainwaves, as opposed to the kind of faster beta brainwaves that when you're having a conversation, you're solving a puzzle, you're doing something like that. So these, uh, so traveling back and forth on the ferry, I was exposed to these [00:15:00] very powerful, low frequency brainwave, entrainment frequencies. And then you could very quickly fall into a relaxed, open monitoring meditation. And that was through through sound and the brainwave entrainment, but that's, that's recent history. That's not my earliest memories of being in the fog when I was five years old. fawn: [00:15:21] Yeah. You mentioned that before. What do you mean when you said that it took me to Santa Monica because we had, what was it called? Matt when w the. The, the Marine layer. Matt: [00:15:35] So it was always overcast until you got about a mile inland, which is not where we ever fawn: [00:15:40] went. So yeah, we always had was, so there was a big street that would go all through LA called Lincoln and in our neighborhood, we would even have t-shirts that said always West of Lincoln, AWOL, always West of Lincoln, because on our side, towards the ocean, Like literally across the [00:16:00] street from Lincoln, we had Marine layer and the vibe was different. The sounds were different. The temperature was a good 15 degrees different. And then you literally cross the street, this big street Lincoln. And it was, it was this, the vibration was hectic. It was loud. And the sun was blaring on you. Michael: [00:16:22] Right. I've never been to Santa Monica, but I've, I lived in San Francisco and, um, you know, the fog there is very predictable. It comes in every day. Well, in the hate, it comes in every day at four 30 in the summer. And, um, neighborhood to neighborhood you'll have, uh, a fog neighborhood or not a fog neighborhood. And each of those neighborhoods has a different, um, tambour and feel, um, Yeah, so fog is Fogg's wonderful. Fogg's, uh, you know, it's, it's a flood, right? And it is fluid. Um, it's, uh, nearly formless. And so when we have fog experiences, we're [00:17:00] experiencing something that is closer to the unformed. You know, the mystery before things take shape inform, uh, which is, you know, so all forms of rise from no form. And so having fog experiences, you can do this with a steaming cup of tea also, but having a fog, it's really nice because it's a very immersive, right. Uh, so having a fog experience like that can kind of bring us back to this primordial pre preformed time. And I think that's part of what we're recognizing in fog experience is it's not quite informed yet. Matt: [00:17:44] Yeah. And certainly when I'm in a fog, when I'm quote unquote, like driving through a fog, you're, you're much more introspective and you're much more cautious and you're much more definitely I'm in my head when I'm quote unquote in a physical fog, fawn: [00:17:58] for sure. But [00:18:00] also that's where the magic happens is in the space of the unknown. When there's no thing, no sound, no one. That's I think when you, I mean, scientists are now totally recording all this, that everything manifests within that space of nothingness where it's not formed yet. Michael: [00:18:22] Yeah. There's a great allowing. For inspired thought to come in. If the egoic mind is running all the time, I know mine wants to run the show and she does a pretty good job. No, it does a good job of taking over from my essential self. It doesn't do a good job of running the show at all and messes things up. Um, but if we, uh, if we, you know, that, um, that allowing in the silence that, that you said, stillness, silence, we want it. Nothingness then allow for inspired thought, you know, um, I'm a, a reader of a, and have been for a long time of, [00:19:00] uh, of course in miracles and, um, fawn: [00:19:04] Marianne Williamson love her. Michael: [00:19:06] Yeah, I I've never read her, um, her interpretation of it. I know that she really popularized it in the eighties, but I've never read her work, um, inspired by it, but inspired thought. And the course of course in miracles says that the Holy spirit doesn't speak for nor the loudest I'm paraphrasing here. Okay. Uh, I think what the course means by that is sitting in stillness and allowing stillness and allowing spaciousness allows. Thus still small, very quiet, inspired thoughts to arise. The quick response, the quick to jump in finishing someone's sentence, as they're speaking, this is, uh, an almost, um, you know, I interpret that as almost like an egoic need to be heard and to be right or to create drama. [00:20:00] That's interesting. But, but stillness, you know, there was, uh, the, uh, falling, you talked about the, the, uh, podcast conference that we were at, that, that we met at, and there was a wonderful presenter. Um, Raquel Ark, a R K I think her name is, she was talking about how, if you're interviewing someone, it takes almost eight seconds for the subject to be able to sit with the question and have. An honest, informed, spontaneous, truly spontaneous answer to arise. That's not part of a rehearse pattern. So she was really advocating for the allowing of spaciousness. And that's a it's, you know, it's difficult to do because we're not. We don't practice that very much fawn: [00:20:46] uncomfortable as I'm interrupting you. It's very uncomfortable because I think we all know that in that space, what can come up, all the things that need to come up [00:21:00] will come up and maybe we want to suppress that. Maybe Michael: [00:21:03] not go. Yeah, that's a, that's a great insight. Like, keep it, keep it busy so that we don't have fawn: [00:21:10] to deal with it. Michael: [00:21:11] All right. No, the, uh, the stillness, spaciousness and silence, uh, can be really uncomfortable. And that's, you know, that's one of the reasons why we made, um, while we made now tone therapy is, uh, in three minutes it gives a complete life cycle. You know, it allows people to experience a complete life cycle of, of, um, emptiness and stillness. Then I sort of. Inspired intention to act then from stillness emerges. Sounds. Those sounds very. And change over time as all forms do. And then those sounds fade away as all forms do and return to stillness again. So [00:22:00] we, we made something that in three minutes, you know, the most, this is a hardware device. So it's a hardware meditation device, two little speakers you're holding your hands. Um, but it's really an experience. And then it's an experience of, of, uh, a life cycle. Over and over again. And, and we made it only three minutes long. And then the question, the most popular question we always get is I love this. I want it to last longer. This is like the conundrum of life. Isn't it. When your life is going good, do you want the life to live? I want more of that good life. And then when it's not going so well, I would prefer not to have this particular life right now. So we, we made now in three minutes to give you a complete life cycle of a stillness emerging form, and then form that fades and returns to stillness. And if you, and if we made it continuous, Without the ending gap, without that ending, uh, into return to stillness, we, we would not have made [00:23:00] something that is true. And one of the overall over writing experiences with tone therapy is that there is a kind of truth that comes through. There are multiple truths, but there's, um, this emerging from nothing returning to nothing is true. That's a kind of truth and it's experienced as truth. Matt: [00:23:21] Now were you also inspired? I know that, uh, there are certain practices of meditation that, you know, they bang a gong and you're supposed to focus on the sound and then the sound obviously fades away. And that that's like your entry point to a meditation. You can say no Michael: [00:23:43] short answer. No, uh, long, long, longer answer. Um, I was trained in practice as an audio product design engineer for many years. And so after you breadboard a circuit and you build it out and then you, um, then you run some [00:24:00] signals through it, and then you listen to the result of that circuit. The kind of work that I was doing was for motion picture sound, and this is back in the analog days. And, um, yeah. Uh, analog noise reduction circuits, uh, to keep the sound of the clicks and pops and his and haze of emotion, picture optical soundtrack from getting in the way of the speech and the music. So I was working on noise reduction systems, uh, and, and one aspect of my job was to listen to the effect of the circuits I had built. And that meant listening and following sounds all the way down into the background haze of the optical soundtrack or magnetic tape recording medium in those days. And I realized that when I followed sound so intensely like that in the context of my job as an audio engineer, in the context of, of, you know, designing products and, uh, and listening to them that I found, [00:25:00] I found I could not be thinking. At the same time as I, as listening, if I was truly bringing an intentional attention to listening, right. It could not be thinking at the same time. And then only years later, did I say, Whoa, wait a minute. That sort of matches up with some of the check boxes of what meditation is, you know, an intentional and intentional unintentional nonjudgmental focus on the present moment. But in my case, In my case in the, in the oral dimension. fawn: [00:25:36] I wonder if that's one of the reasons music is so healing. I think most songs are three minutes or I actually, I looked it up it's three minutes and 20 seconds or most songs and lately, um, I read that it's now 20 seconds shorter these days. And I wonder if that's because people. Just [00:26:00] don't have the attention Michael: [00:26:01] span or, and when I was, when I was a pup in the sixties, uh, you know, uh, progressive music, you know, the FM radio progressive rock, right? Uh, the songs sweet, the eight or nine or 12 minute extended version that would then be cut and you need to make a three minute and 20 seconds single version of that. So, yeah, th there are these different, uh, Oh, um, uh, Forums form, uh, durations, uh, the pop song three minutes, three classic pop song or symphonic, um, for much longer. Uh, but they, but they both have, you know, start, uh, evolution and ending. And, um, yeah, so connecting with, uh, the impermanence that, you know, the arising from nothing and to, to hearing something and that something changes and then something goes away. Uh, I used to love, you know, I'd have, uh, you know, get your favorite 45 RPM record and say, man, I will just leave that thing on all [00:27:00] day long and just go over and over and over and over again, love that so much, but, but at least there was a little bit of gap between the successive plays. Um, right. That favorite record Matt: [00:27:13] right now, question audio engineer. The loudness Wars. Do you think that those are serving us or not serving like Phil Spector popularized? The whole making everything allowed her and all the artists were like, make it louder. And so what do they call it? But what is that scale? It's like a D there's like a Dr. Number, like dynamic range. I think it might stand for. And the higher, the number, the more actual, quiet to loud happens, the whole crescendos. How do you feel about like popular music and the loudness Wars? Michael: [00:27:47] Uh, you know, I came across a quote this morning of, uh, Walt Whitman and he said something like, um, am I contradictions? Well, I am, I am everything. So, so be it with contradiction. Uh, so my [00:28:00] answer is, uh, yeah, uh, loud, this war is good and bad aggressive use of compression. That's the type of circuit that, that reduces loud sounds to the mid range and brings quiet sounds up. To the mid range to meet them. It helps with intelligibility of speech. So it's a good technique for speech where you're really trying to focus on the voice. And maybe there's some background noise in the place where you're, when you're listening, uh, uh, road noise or in a car. So FM, radio, or even am going back to the days of am radio. Okay. Loudness compression is almost essential. Uh, early days of telephony telephony com compress the, the dynamic range to emphasize the volume aspects of the voice that are key to intelligibility. So it's good when it's used in music, it can be used as a musical effect and some of the earliest, um, uses of compression, aggressive compression, dynamic range reduction. Um, And pop music would be like [00:29:00] some of the earlier Beale. Well, from the time of, uh, let's say, uh, rubber soul Beatles, rubber soul, 66, late 65 recordings. When the drum recordings of Ringo's drums were heavily compressed. So you would get this, the kick drum would slam in and then it would be this. Reduction in volume following the kick drum hit. And then there would be a rapid swelling back up in between the kick drum beats. And what would happen is you'd get a, a cymbal sound that would was quite unlike a normal symbol. Normally when you hit a symbol, you hear the Pang crash decay. But these early recordings of a, of Ringo's drum kit, and with only two mikes with heavy, heavy compression, you'd get a, you get a swelling of a symbol that was like, like a backward sound to like, then you're hearing, um, Oh my God, the [00:30:00] world has gone backwards or something is, you know, in, in, in the middle of this beat is a part that seems like it's backwards. So that's a, that's a beautiful use of, of compression. Now the worst use of compression is when you take the entire song, the entire production and, and smash that down so that there's almost no moments, a moment amplitude variation, you know, maybe a DB or two of amplitude variation so that it slams and, um, the, the, the, um, Broadcast channel or the recording channel, uh, and an attempt to make that song appear to be louder than those songs around it. But when everyone does it, there's no difference. Right? So you haven't achieved the end of standing out. You've just literally leveled the playing field amongst all the participants. So that's a. That's a, that's the [00:31:00] answer? So, uh, dynamic range and processing. Um, yeah. Good. Yeah. Good, bad and ugly. fawn: [00:31:06] Right? Speaking of good, bad, good, bad, and ugly. I have a question to pose. I have my own theories, but not really. I would love your take on technically scientifically vibrationally. Why sounds affect us the way they do, for example. The good, you know, hearing a good sound that will soothe you or hearing a piece of music that for three minutes makes your ego mind be quiet so you can totally just listen without having your own input. I think that's why music can be so moving because it takes you out of yourself and into the wider spectrum of the universe. But, and then you hear sounds like I heard about the government's having a certain sound wave that [00:32:00] can destroy somebody. Remember ma we would watch, it was a couple of years ago, how they would like one forest would out in the ocean, points the sound at a ship that would make them go crazy. Right. You know, what is it about sound it's this other REL sound as it, as it relates to us as human beings, connecting with one another and understanding one another or the other way around making us fight each other, um, or causing harm to our bodies. And then there's also sound there's sound therapy, sound bath. There are these sounds that actually will heal cells. What is it? It's it's really, Oh, it's like diving into the ocean with discovering all these things that we're not aware of yet, you know? Yeah. [00:33:00] Michael: [00:33:00] It's um, I'll try to give a short, short answer. Um, and, uh, and, and to make the answer shorter, I'm going to put aside, um, Um, idiomatic expression. Um, so let's group music that has genres, new age music, jazz, hip hop, rock, rap, whatever, all wrap it all up in one balloon and put it to the side for a moment so that we can concentrate on the more abstract qualities of sound and not the idiomatic expression. That's culturally informed. So I'm not responding to music because it's from the place and time of my birth and early childhood. It's it's, you know, it's comforting to me because it reminds me of home or it reminds me of a certain being a certain age. So let's take all of that aside because that's all true. That's all true. But, but my work and my understanding comes through the empirical [00:34:00] work that I've done with more abstract sound and the basic physical dimensions of sound that is amplitude. How loud or soft. Uh, frequency how high or how low, um, uh, and, uh, tambour, which is another word for, for tone. That is the tone quality. Is it buzzy or is it, uh, more, uh, flute, like a simple, simple sine waves. And then how do those, uh, how are those qualities, uh, combined together? Um, and then how do they change over time? Um, now when you w you opened the show by talking about Santa Monica and the ocean, and, uh, this is something, you know, this is a sound that a lot of people are familiar with this crashing waves or even lapping water that's. Um, that is broad band sound. It's a lot of frequencies all at the [00:35:00] same time, mashed up together that the ear in her interprets as a. Right. A lot of different frequencies. You don't recognize any one particular frequency and in a noise source like that broadband noise source and, and noise doesn't mean I'm. And here, I'm just saying, it gives you going to, as an engineering term noise, uh, without any value judgment attached to it. So it's just a broadband signal that we would call noise. The opposite of that would be a single tone. Like you would hear from a Tibetan bowl as you were S. Scraping the Stryker around the outside of the bowl. More, more pure tone sound. Um, so we have, we have, um, noise. Oh, there's a continuum between noise and, um, pure tone. And both of those types of sounds [00:36:00] can affect us psychologically because there can be some truths. The, the sounds that are impactful. I think the sounds that are impactful are expressions of truth. And then our soul and mind resonates to truth. You know, when someone lies to you, there's a discomfort that's associated with this shared knowing that the person knows that they're lying and it comes across in their voice. And then you know that they're lying and, and you know, that they know that, you know, so the whole thing is a big ball of discomfort. And, you know, we've lived through and we're currently living through we, um, a lot of the chaos of disinformation and lack of truth. So music and sound is a way for us to parse our way through an intentional misuse of sound, to obscure and [00:37:00] confuse and to sow chaos. Now, the former president. Would not have been elected, had so many of us given that person attention and listen to that person sound right. You know, or we're all somewhat complicit and bringing our attention, uh, two lies. You would think that, Oh my God lives have to be called out and, and, and, uh, reacted to, well, no, that feeds the monster. But it let's, you know, my work, uh, uh, is an attempt to say, well, here's truth. Let's, let's bundle up all the lies and turn our backs to them. Turn our backs to that profanity and inhabit truth and see how that feels. Right. And that's where we live and that's so when people say, [00:38:00] well, now it makes me really now tone therapy. It really gets me relaxed. Well, in part that's because you're not getting lied to. fawn: [00:38:08] How do you do that though? How do you turn your back on it? Matt: [00:38:13] Yeah. It, it, it has a nasty habit of, unless you call it out for what it is, it has a nasty habit of just being repeated and echoed and echoed and echoed in your own mind. Sometimes he asks him sometimes just in popular culture Michael: [00:38:25] or, yeah, well, uh, to, to Fonz question, how do you tune that out? Well, it's practice. Um, this is, this is another type of mindfulness practice that you have to have an intention. You have to willfully use your attention. You know, bring in, I'm always combining the word attention with an, a, an intention. You have to have an intention to listen attentively and to direct your attention because, um, um, to interact with free, will we have a free, we have, we have a free, we have the freewill to do this. How do we do that? [00:39:00] Oh, you can substitute it, but something else to begin. Well, you can get a singing bowl. If you play an instrument pluck. The string on an instrument or tone and hum to fawn: [00:39:11] yourself. So causing an interference? Michael: [00:39:14] Um, no, I wouldn't call it an interference. I would call it, um, focus, uh, a shift in focus as an eight. These are AIDS to give the mind another form object. To a light upon and doing that intentionally free will is something that, uh, it's like a muscle, right? And you can, sometimes you want to exercise your free will. And other times you don't, you know, I know that I have this problem. Well, I know what my, I know what, you know, my, my true essential self. Consciousness would have me do, but then there was like, well, let me just dip my toe in this mess over here and see how that [00:40:00] feels. Matt: [00:40:01] Yeah, no, no, no, no. I totally get it. Sometimes I'll wake up. And first thing in the morning, my brain just starts spinning. And if I wake up too early and I know I'm going to be tired all day, I don't want to think, I just want to go back to sleep for instance. And so I will turn on, uh, and listen to something. And, you know, that kind of sets my kind of higher mind. My thinking mind starts to quiet down and starts to quiet down. And finally, then I can go back to sleep. Um, you know, and it's just a question of, I'm just not ready to spin it all up yet. fawn: [00:40:40] It saw, kind of reminds me of when we had our first child and. That's Al Al would be crying and crying and crying. And I would do everything in my power to ease the situation, ease her, you know, I would start from the basics, like, [00:41:00] is it a diaper? Is it a burp? Is it something tight on her? Like her clothes don't fit or whatever, all of that. And nothing would work and she'd still be crying. And are you, so is this kind of like, On the realm of sound changing things up. So I, I said interference, but Matt, will I call it cutting your key in martial arts? So Matt would take owl and he would take her into another room or take her out in nature, like remove her from that. Situation, give her a different perspective, different sounds, different temperature, different environment, going back to communication, and maybe you're hearing a lie. Usually I know when someone is lying, when I can feel a gap in my brain. Like they're talking, but it doesn't make sense [00:42:00] on some other level on a deep, deep level where they're, I, I, there's a gap. Like there's a, there's just a gap is all I can describe it as, um, there's a point in time where there's nothingness and to, to get at the truth. My question was, how do we, how do we do that? How do we get to the truth? Do we dive into that gap? Where there's nothingness, where in your brain, there's no sound Michael: [00:42:32] well, you have, um, you know, you suggest a good way to do it, which was paying attention to your body signals. And this is easier for some people than others. You know, the F for people who are, it's not my first mode, right. Paying attention to my body and my emotions, you know, it's, it's partially gendered. Um, You know, it can be developed. We can all develop that. So yeah. Paying attention to what your body, how does it feel in the gut? How does it right. [00:43:00] Tension, no tension. Yeah. So I think you're, you're, you're certainly right about, about. Recognizing what the body fawn: [00:43:08] is doing. It's so weird because I don't consider my brain as part of my body when you're saying that I'm like, it's not in my body, Michael it's in my brain. The brain is the body. Isn't that weird though? I just realized that. But yeah, there's a, there's a, yeah, I have to get back into that space. Like what. I always say this. I always have, when I'm talking to someone on the phone, I can always tell when they're not listening, because I find myself shouting or my voice goes up and I'm trying to get louder. And as soon as I catch myself doing that, I'm like, Oh man, this person is not listening to me. So, you know, but I can't put blame on that because I think we're in. Society now in such a way that we all have so much pain and it, you can describe it as not pain. You can [00:44:00] describe it as there's so much that needs attention. And we all haven't had attention placed on the things that desperately need it. So that's why people interrupt each other because they desperately want to be heard. And they desperately also want to be hearing. The other person, but if, if we're both, if both sides are having such, um, turmoil in a way, maybe that's not the right word. Matches raises eyebrows up because I'm sure that's not what he would say. He says, I tend to get negative with my descriptions, but what I'm saying is I think we're all experiencing so much and we, that it's a give and take. And right now we need to speak. We need to have our sounds, need to be expressed and released. At the same time. I think we're in a culture where there's so much coming at us where we're hearing so much and we're [00:45:00] seeing so much, and all of our senses are on overload. That the basic sound, the basic thing is the sound. And I think if we start from there, I think that will start some. Some healing is if we go back to the quiet and then slowly introduce reintroduce sound to each other, if we go back into the quiet and really listen to ourselves, and then we're able to listen to the birds outside, we're able to listen to. A new friend standing in front of us to understand what they're really saying instead of putting our own baggage, our own history into what they're saying. Do you guys see what I'm saying? Yeah, Matt: [00:45:51] no, no, no, I totally get it. Um, no argument. I mean, we're certainly our brains are getting reprogrammed to be like these multitasking monsters. And [00:46:00] it's hard for us to focus solely on one thing at a time anymore, because cause we don't have to, I've got my computer and I can Google this while I'm talking to that and I can see this and I can listen to that and I can do a million things at once. And you know, I think on some level. It does our, does our census of service, but on another level, it doesn't, it makes it harder to be quiet and still, fawn: [00:46:23] and I think we should go back to in utero, you know, like hearing that ocean sound when you're in the womb. Michael: [00:46:33] Well, you know, to stay on this idea of truth and. Truth being, um, comforting and untruth, not being comforting. Um, I'm a comfortably lapsed, um, Roman Catholic and, um, so, um, I don't have any problem like using the Christian terminology and mythology. Um, so you can substitute whatever your favorite words are for these concepts. But you know, in the beginning, [00:47:00] before there was anything, and then there was something and then what happened? Um, God said, Through the first thing that happened was God speaking versus nothing, then God speaks. Then God creates light. fawn: [00:47:15] Oh my God. Right? Yeah. Like Michael: [00:47:18] so, so there's, it's, it's really kind of huge when you think that, um, enlight is what we use to, um, to be able to perceive forms, you know, objects, object forms, um, sound, sound objects. We are, are a bit more ephemeral because they are truly not fixed informed. They're they're moving through time. They're constantly evolving through time. So they're less like they're less like a form than they are like energy. So I'd like to remind myself that before there was anything. Before there was light in physical objects. It was sound. And before there was sound, there was nothing. Wow. You can kind of work your way back to silence. And then that, uh, uh, the [00:48:00] experience of, um, that's that stillness, fawn: [00:48:02] you know, I'm a big fan of Gregg, Braden and Joe Dispenza. And. I was, I spent like a week long time with Greg Brayden and one of his workshops and we were concentrating on sound and he, he kept emphasizing that as creatures. We are, he said we are unique. I really don't think so because I think every creature makes sound, but he was talking about how your sound, your ability to vocalize something, manifest things. And because we can create sound from, from this area, the throat that it is, uh, it is a tool that will manifest things in physical form. I tend to think every. Creature will do that. Right. Birds will do that, I think. Yeah. Do you know where I'm getting at? Like, I [00:49:00] just think Michael: [00:49:01] you gotta be careful with that manifestation stuff, you know? fawn: [00:49:05] Oh, right. Because you hear all the time. If you speak it out loud, that's the first step. Well, the first step is the quiet. I'm sorry. Michael: [00:49:16] You can manifest, you know, you can manifest the ego can manifest quite well too. And then that's going to be a boatload of pain. Eventually Matt: [00:49:27] it depends. Right? Because, you know, I would say almost on a most primordial level, a bird will make noise in order to announce that they're there and then a mate shows up and then , you know, that's a very straight line, very scientific way of looking at things. You know, versus, you know, I imagine I have a winning lottery ticket and boom, it's right there to it. And that feels more mystical. And yet, you know, the birds dead, it's just how it works. And Michael: [00:49:58] yeah. Yeah. When you, when you get to [00:50:00] the level of the human, where we have conscious intention, it can, we can load that manifestation activity or the gap. Deepak Chopra likes to say, it's like, And cert the intention in between the gap and thoughts, or Frep the intention with a gap and then into that gap of no thinking and then into that gap in certain intention. And then, then boom, you know, you've kind of loaded your intention with that manifest. You've loaded the manifestation with an intention. That's more conscious. So yeah, we so. We're not bird-like in that way. You guys, fawn: [00:50:39] the gap is great. I love that one. Isn't it reminds me of London. When I would get on the tube, what did they call it? I don't remember what they called it, but the train, you know, underground the underground. And you would always hear that voice come up and it would say mind the gap. Michael: [00:50:58] And I wonder how many, you know, what [00:51:00] percentage of people actually did mind the gap? Matt: [00:51:03] I was there. I was like, I don't want to get hurt, but yeah, I think, I think the first 20 times you hear it, you certainly hear it. But then I think after a while, it just kind of blends into your reality and you know what you're doing. Michael: [00:51:15] So yeah, in China, it's funny that they don't tell you the mind, the gap they tell you quite, uh, quite clearly to step back from, from, from the, uh, from the train. And they have, uh, right on the floor. They've got, um, um, you know, stand here even before COVID painted on the floor, we'd be the footsteps. So you stand here, you stand there and say, uh, and that's really interesting, you know, because, um, you know, it's a bit more of an authoritary immigrant. We're gonna compare 'em day in the life in London, day in the life, in, uh, in Shenzhen or Beijing. It's a bit more authoritarian, uh, experience. Um, In in China. Uh, so, so rather than this, allowing, you know, th th the [00:52:00] in, in, in Britain, uh, the subway safety message of minding the gap, which is a beautiful. Double entendre, right? Uh, the mind, the physical gap, and maybe you might want to consider paying attention to what your mind is doing and the gap in between thoughts or pate. Right. Um, but, but in China they say, don't go there. fawn: [00:52:24] I was wondering Michael: [00:52:25] doing that. Don't go there. fawn: [00:52:29] Oh my God. It's so true. And there, you know what, now I get it and it's quite beautiful. Sometimes you need to, we will take Michael: [00:52:36] care of it. We will take care of that gap for you, fawn: [00:52:40] but you know what, sometimes you need to hear that. Don't go there. Because I can easily go into this messed up memory or messed up thing. Yeah. Yeah. Just don't go there. Someone has to tell me that. Matt: [00:52:53] See, I'm just laughing because every time like we start talking over a movie, cause that's what we do, uh, as a, as a household [00:53:00] and, and my wife was like, can you guys please be quiet? Cause I want to hear this. Then we all yell. Don't go in there. Cause that's something you yell during a horror movie, right? Like, you know, the stupid heroin is about to walk in and encounter the, the, you know, our antagonist. fawn: [00:53:17] Uh, I used to watch movies in peace and quiet, and I am grateful. I'm grateful. I have a family. However, looking at a movie, it's just the movie experience I haven't had in many years because these guys will just talk. I don't understand is, is something happening to my hearing that. I can't listen and hear at the same time. Like I can't hear the movie and hear you guys at the same time. Are you guys able to hear what's going on in the mood? No, of course not. I'm not Matt: [00:53:48] paying attention to a score. So why a plan? Oh, my clowning. That's what I do. fawn: [00:53:52] I've try to watch a movie anyway. We digress. That's what we do. And other thing that trips me out is [00:54:00] when I hear politicians or I hear just anybody actually. Would they start raising their voice, like what is happening? Right. I don't trust the person that raises their voice. It just makes me feel like they're losing control or they're lying, or they're trying to really push something they know is not right. Or pushing something that they know you don't think is. Right. So they're going to yell at when someone has an even keel. Speaking voice. Why is that so much better? Matt: [00:54:37] Well, it, it depends on where your head is at, you know, um, yeah, one of the unfortunate, great lessons, Adolf Hiller told us as a repo, uh, lie repeated loud enough, often enough becomes truth in people's minds. Wow. Speaking with a calm, even voice, you have the opportunity to lose what I call the soundbite [00:55:00] test. So if I can snip out like two seconds of what you've said, that totally contradicts what you've said, you lose. And that's where we are today in a, in America. We're very much a soundbite mentality because we're kind of bumbling through so many things at a given moment. So if I say something like such and such as bad, and I don't really mean it, or, I mean it sarcastically that meaning can still get lost because of somebody can slice out just that tiny soundbite, Michael: [00:55:28] this, um, This, this challenge of, um, uh, linguistics words, right? Subject object, uh, language and how, and how loud or not loud language is spoken, um, is fascinated me for a long time. And I think that's in part, what has brought me to this pure tone work that I do, which is, um, carries truth, but it's it's but not being carried by words. So it can be experienced as truth and not be, [00:56:00] um, rejected or, um, folks radar don't go up as quickly. Um, so I, so I think what we're able to do with, uh, with tone therapy in these, in a very short period of time, and sometimes even just a fraction of a second of a cup, a few seconds is convey a sense of truth. That transcends the limitations of subject object, uh, language duality, because it's so easy to be reactive to, um, to the words he said. And then he said, fawn: [00:56:39] uh, should I, should we play? Should we play a little bit right now, Michael? Michael: [00:56:47] We could. Yeah. uh, ready? Ready? Okay. All right. Let's um, let's just take three minutes and listen to now, um, the present [00:57:00] moment and Mo, and the way we can make this easier is by listening to, um, a little. Meditation device, a sound meditation device called now tone therapy. Uh, it, it takes just three minutes to listen to this. Um, and all you have to do is, um, bring in an intention to listen attentively. Now it's natural for thoughts to arise, and as they do, just notice that you have thoughts arising, but bring your attention, bring your attention back to the sounds and, um, Enjoy the, uh, enjoy the gap between thoughts. You'll notice that. And that's a beautiful thing because that's, uh, that's your essential self. That is what is noticing is consciousness. And, um, let's uh, let's just give it a listen. fawn: [00:57:53] Okay, here we go. [00:58:00] Track 4: [00:58:09] uh, uh, [01:01:00] [01:00:00] [00:59:00] uh, Michael: [01:01:22] I'd like to have a big breath, you know, a big release and then an honor that space, and then gradually come back to the business at hand. It doesn't have to be fawn: [01:01:32] long. Can I describe what goes through my spirit? What I get from it is so add to remind myself to just focus on the sound and nothing else. And then I started to actually see waves. Like when you throw a pebble into water and you see. The rings expanding one by one. I saw that cause I was trying to close my eyes so I could [01:02:00] really just focus on one thing, which was the sound. And it made me realize that that's the only way to really get to a healing state, whether it's emotional healing, physical healing, because life is really quite simple. If you'll allow for the focus on one thing to occur and not putting your attention and your focus on so many things at the same time, because I think what happens is pieces of ourselves ended up dispersing everywhere. And we're not there. Like if you could imagine you're a whole thing. And if one piece of you goes over here, one piece of vehicles in this other direction, It's like you're exploding into space and all these different directions. And you're not in the now that you're not in that one point in the universe and for anything to happen for your [01:03:00] dreams to come true for you to be able to love for you, to be able to see you have to bring yourself into that one pinpoint part of the universe for, for a little bit. And it's and it's apropos that this is called now. Did you mean for that to happen, Michael? Yeah, it has. Michael: [01:03:24] It has two, two meetings, right? The present moment. And it's also, it's an acronym for new origin wave forms. So each moment is a, is a new moment being created and carried forward through sound waves, new origin, making a new moment. So, yeah, the present moment and also new origin through wave forms. I fawn: [01:03:47] have, I have a little story that will maybe help. What I'm talking about is there was a moment I was on a photo shoot and it was going through something horrible. There [01:04:00] was, it was, uh, there was some trauma, there was, um, was actually a stalker was after me and I was out, uh, in. The what seemed like out in the middle of nowhere, but it was where I worked the corporation I was working for. It was there. And, um, I had had a harrowing night actually the next morning. So I went a night without sleep. So much was happening. I was under so much stress the next morning at 6:00 AM. I was on a photo shoot. I was a photographer and I was standing there. And this woman that I worked with who works for the corporation also, she was standing there. She was in management. So she was helping me with a photo shoot and she knew what was going on. She knew what had happened. Everyone was on high alert and the building, and she looked at me, she smiled and she said, [01:05:00] Child of God. Are you happy? First of all, for her to say child of God, because I wasn't religious, was it tweaked me a little bit? And then for her to say, are you happy with a smile on her face? And really, uh, it really bothered me. Like, are you crazy? You know what what's been happening? The whole building is like on alert. And you're asking me if I'm happy. And I don't know what I said to her. I probably didn't say anything. I probably looked really confused and I was exhausted. And she said, she, she kept repeating that to me. And she knew, or maybe I said, are you crazy? And she said, look right in this moment right now. So she gave me these steps. She's like right now, where are you standing right now? Are you not standing in front of me right now? Are you not at a room that is [01:06:00] beautiful right now. Are you not surrounded by people who are protecting you right now? Don't you have everything that is making you, your body, everything comfortable right now? Is it not peaceful right now? Like she kept saying that she brought me to. That precise moment that if you break it down, if you keep breaking down right now, right now, right now, everything else disappears and everything is okay. If you go into that space of right now, you can strip out everything else that is happening that is distracting and pulling you in different directions. And I think that's what happens when you listen to this. Michael: [01:06:55] Yeah, and it, you know, getting to right now then allows for the inspired [01:07:00] thought that allows, that can empower change or in the case of your story, taking appropriate protective actions, asking for help. All of this can come from a truly empowered, inspired moment. So it's not passive. It's really. Still act, it's still action and stillness. Really? That being able to connect to the present moment doesn't mean that we don't, that we can function in the world. We can function better actually. fawn: [01:07:31] Absolutely better. Matt, you're quiet. Yes. Why are you quiet? You're in the Matt: [01:07:37] now maybe. fawn: [01:07:40] Well, we know that sound. Is one of the key factors in creation first comes nothing, then comes sound, and then comes what? The Michael: [01:07:53] 10,000 things. Yeah. Matt: [01:07:55] The 10,000 things. But I would argue first comes thought, then come sound, then [01:08:00] comes, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Because you have to set your intention before you, right? Michael: [01:08:05] Yeah. Now we're getting metaphysical. fawn: [01:08:11] Well, Shall we continue this for another time it leave it. Sure. The peaceful, peaceful. Now then the peaceful now Michael: [01:08:24] really, really nice, uh, visit and a wonderful way to, to finish here and for me to start my day. fawn: [01:08:30] Cool. Thank you so much for being with us. We want to thank Michael: [01:08:36] you both. fawn: [01:08:36] Yeah. I look forward to future conversations with you. There's so much to explore. Seems that way. Doesn't it? It does. I think, I think this conversation really had so many facets we could have gone into that I really wanted to go into, but I was trying to be quiet. Matt: [01:08:55] Me too. fawn: [01:08:56] Actually. I don't like it when you're quiet. Matt: [01:08:58] I know, but you [01:09:00] know, you did shush me at one point. fawn: [01:09:03] I did. Michael: [01:09:05] That was the ocean waves. Matt: [01:09:07] And that was not, um, a mother lovingly shush. Michael: [01:09:11] Oh, I would like to swap some stories around, um, uh, you know, place as a teacher. And we can, we can do that at another time. I love that idea that, uh, you know, Santa Monica, as a teacher, there are many different kinds of teachers we can talk about. We can have a whole conversation around teachers and students, different kinds of teachers. Absolutely love that places can be teachers for me, read flutes. Our, our teachers. And, uh, I'll try to paraphrase the, uh, the classic Rumi poem, uh, you know, the Reed flute, which, which is, Oh my God, I'm speaking to a woman that should be quite familiar with it. Reed flute, fawn: [01:09:51] my family. Michael: [01:09:53] Yeah. So these reeds grow. By the side of, uh, where it's moist by the side of the [01:10:00] stream. And, um, they, they reach up to the heavens, they, the flowers catch the light and they, the roots are in the ground. So it's really a beautiful conduit between the sky and the earth. And when these reeds are picked and dried and then shaped into flutes, that the sound that they make when you play a Reed flute. And I believe this Rumi poem is called the sound of the song of the Reed flute. Uh, it's a very mournful tambour, and that's because the Reed flute remembers it's a right relationship between the sun and the earth and its relationship to its brethren. And it longs for all of that together is the beloved. So it, it longs for the sun and lungs for its feet to be in the ground and longs to be next to its brethren and the Reed Grove and the sound and the music that comes from the Reed flute. It's quite poignantly, um, as a quite poignant, longing, uh, timber. [01:11:00] fawn: [01:11:00] Nice. Michael: [01:11:02] So that's a teacher, you know, so the read flutes for me, I used to make these things. I found them. I found them growing up in coastal Maine when my daughters and I, and we're on vacation. And when they were very young and I started making these floods. And so they became the flute itself, the read itself taught me how to make a flute and then through playing them. There's other kinds of learnings that come in from those teachers. So there are plant teachers, there are place city teachers, there's all kinds of fawn: [01:11:28] teachers. Definitely the squirrel outside has been my teacher for the past year. What Matt: [01:11:34] be greedy and get fat. fawn: [01:11:35] No. Oh, the school comes up and I just learned so much from the squirrel. Like just keep, you know, just simple play and they survive out there. Here we are inside. It gets negative 20 degrees Fahrenheit out here and they're still like, Jill, you know, they, they move on with life and they're still cute [01:12:00] and happy and bouncing around and playing all the time. Before we go, I want to ask you a question. Both of you, Michael you first, what is your favorite sound in the world? Michael: [01:12:16] My favorite sound in the world is a sound I never get to hear because I'm, um, I have a. Tinnitus, which is described as ringing in the ears. You hear tones all the time. It came on very, very gradually I think, as a result of the kind of audio loud audio work I did early in my career. Uh, and I no longer hear silence. So, um, that would be my favorite sound would be the sound of silence. fawn: [01:12:44] Wow. How about you, man? Matt: [01:12:49] Yeah. Wow. As he said it it's like, you know, that moment we have air purifiers and they run all the time in the house for the most part. [01:13:00] But there's a moment where I take the air purifier out of our bedroom and I move it into our study for, so I could begin my day. Uh, and that moment where I unplug it and I can, I can feel the whole world just kind of go like everything everything's quiet. And sometimes I'll turn off the air purifier by the girls. And I literally, I can. Feel a shift in their energy. Just exhale, everything. Just kind of just settles. fawn: [01:13:30] Yeah. Yeah. My favorite sound I have too, is you guys laughing? That's a good sound. The laughter of our children and the laughter of Matt. Matt: [01:13:42] I was going to go that way, but there's a, there's a visual component for me as well. fawn: [01:13:46] And I have another sound and I wouldn't know what the visual component is. I just want to finish. Is the other thing is when I reach out and I hear a friend talking back to me on the other end, [01:14:00] that is a lifesaver right there. True. And it's not fair because I'm the one who asked the question. So I had time to think about it while you guys were talking, but what I need to hear someone's voice to let me know I'm not alone. When I, I, my mind goes into that lie of I'm all alone. Yeah. So what was the visual component you were saying? Matt: [01:14:24] Just there's a brightness in a laugh, right. And I'll see that on, especially Ellis face, but I'll see that on everyone's face as they're laughing all of a sudden, but it's, it's like a little spotlight is shined on their faces. There's a, there's a Glint in the eye. There's the, there's the compression of the cheek into the smile. Right. Um, so it's, there's a visual cause I was thinking the exact same thing, but it's, it's the two of them together. Strictly sound. It's fawn: [01:14:50] that shoe, you know what it is? It's a war. It's a term you use when I first met you. It's a divine spark Matt: [01:14:57] Heyo, right? Yes, it [01:15:00] is very much. It is kind of this connection. It feels like a connection with something higher. fawn: [01:15:06] All right, everybody, we're going to wind it down. Thank you so much, Michael, for being with us today. Michael: [01:15:13] You're very welcome folks. So great fawn: [01:15:15] to be here and everyone, we are going to have a link. To the now, so you can hear more and you can. Figure out where you can get your hands on these things. They're amazing. They're like there is, I've never been near a hockey puck, but is this what it looks like, man? I think Matt: [01:15:36] it's a little bit flatter and maybe a little bit wider, but, um, so the company is called solar S O L U and it's the now and it's two speakers fawn: [01:15:45] and this is, this is not a commercial guys. This is like us for real loving this. Device. Um, we'll put more into our show notes about it. Michael, thank you so much again, and [01:16:00] friends, we will talk to you in a few days. Yes, we will stay in the now take care. We'll talk to you later. Sure.  

Episode 36  The Imprint - We Are Creating  Each Other Side note: At the end of this show, Matt grapples with something he caught himself saying about friendship that really bothered him. So we will have to explore a second half of this topic by bringing an expert on, for another show to remedy things. Pearl of wisdom from Bruno's in Santa Monica – an entity/ parental/protective figure that helps raise the children. This episode is about leadership. Matt explains the concept of servant/leader. We discuss true leadership and what that truly is. We discuss tantrums. In all aspects of life and culture, we are here to take care of each other. We are creating each other. Creativity - creative energies are brewing and are very strong.  I always think about collaboration and creativity; the way we influence each other in conversation, our experience with one another and how they create an imprint; I can be imprinted by your behavior. My behavior could be imprinted on you.  Your behavior towards me can create and impression of you that will be forever imprinted.  It happens in relationships, in business, with leadership, with friendship; all of the ships.       #leader #ittakesavillage #parenthood #friendship #leadership, #business #tantrums #servant #servantleader #despit  #compassion #undercoverboss #tedlasso #ellewoods #legallyblonde #aikido   Transcript [00:00:00] Fawn: [00:00:00] Good morning. Hello? Oh, Matt: [00:00:05] you're gonna have to cut out that first one second. I said evening Fawn: [00:00:08] and now I'm not cutting anything. Oh, dear. How are you guys? Welcome to our friendly world. This is fun. How are you doing? What do you love to, Matt: [00:00:19] what'd you doing? Oh man. I'm feeling energized today. You're in trouble. Fawn: [00:00:23] I, I was, I know, you know what? I, I woke up feeling like I was in trouble. My mind is really preoccupied. I feel not so light in the head, like too many thoughts, too many. Responsibilities too many wants and desires and too many frustrations in my head right now. Matt: [00:00:44] I've been there, but feeling like laser-focused, I'm Fawn: [00:00:48] glad. Okay. I will start with a Pearl of wisdom, Pearl of wisdom, because I usually start by saying it's a nugget of wisdom from Santa Monica. This one is a [00:01:00] Pearl because it has to do with. Transcending time and being a parent, being a grandparent or not that you're a grandparent or parent per se, but  it's the feeling, it's the responsibility aspect of it. It's the aspect of taking care of someone regardless of your age and taking care of them as far as emotional goes. , if you guys have listened to the very, very first it's called the mentor, the mentor is me talking about my mentor and that's the city of Santa Monica. When I was a kid, Santa Monica was always around. I had no idea I was being influenced by this entity. And by the time I was 16, 17. Most of my friends were out of high school. They were in their twenties, they were working professionals. I worked with them and the people that I worked with had other friends. So we all became friends and I was the youngest one in the group. Gotcha. [00:02:00] And one friend was, this was before gay marriage, but they were kind of married. They were together,  to two men in their twenties. , beautiful people and so loving to me. And they really took me under their wing. And because I was having so many problems with my family and there were, there was so much, I was, there was so much I was working on, I was working on my portfolio trying to figure out how to make it as a professional photographer, even back then, as a kid. And they helped me out when they were gorgeous. They were my models because I did these elaborate fashion shoots back then. And, , Michael was,  the higher level tier of this, I don't know if it was a chain back then, a pretty well known hair salon. So he was this really talented hairdresser. And it's really interesting because I always had that , in my field. I always had martial [00:03:00] artists around me and. People that were involved in makeup and hair, you know, because I mean, years later I ended up working for the Aveda corporation. Right. And I was surrounded by that. It was like the professionals in the industry that worked in hair and makeup. So anyway, when I would visit my friends, they lived right on the boardwalk. The Pearl of wisdom comes from a place, a restaurant, an Italian restaurant, and Matt you'll remember, but this restaurant was part of the influence for me when I was a kid, like it was always around and it was Bruno. Remember Bruno's restaurant. Matt: [00:03:41] I was about to ask if it was brewed house, but yeah, of course it must be right there at the base of the, literally the boardwalk, Fawn: [00:03:47] rather. Exactly. It was right on the corner. And the food was lovely, but what was really amazing and comforting was the owner. It was always him, [00:04:00] always working, always cooking. You walk in there. He is, he's waving at you. He's always smiling at you, but he was like a caretaker. He was like a guardian angel for that area. And it, and I just felt like. W, especially at that age, I needed comfort. So my friends gave me comfort, but also Bruno's gave me comfort. Like he was always there and there was just the whole nourishing part of life. That was Bruno's. It was always there. He was always there. Right. So years later, I mean, many years later he was still there. And I remember hanging out with him. And I was hanging out now with now we're, you know, much older. I am anyway, and I'm hanging out with a friend, who's a dad and he has a teenager. And this teenager of his is out of control. Right. And we were always talking about this. I'm [00:05:00] like, why is it the parents look so old? And I remember we were watching opera together. One day we were just sitting in his apartment and we were looking at, this was a long time ago, but we were looking at, uh, a panel and I don't remember what the discussion was about, but they were, they were parents and they were talking about their children and they looked really old to me. So I looked over to my friend I'm like, because they said how old they were. Okay. And I was shocked that they were actually that young because they looked really old handled to my friend. I'm like, why do they look like that? He didn't even skip a beat. He goes their parents. Matt: [00:05:44] Oh my Fawn: [00:05:44] goodness. What do you mean? He goes, it it's stressful. Fun. Like, what are you talking about? And so, anyway, that's when he started talking about.  What he's going through with his son, with his teenage son, like this guy is out of control. , he [00:06:00] doesn't talk he's into bad things, but I don't know exactly what is happening. There's no communication. It's like the tantrums are on another level. When they're at that age tantrums, Matt: [00:06:13] I was about to say, and you would call them tantrums. Fawn: [00:06:15] I now would call them tantrums because I've seen. Tantrums take place, not only with toddlers, but heads of CEOs. I've seen tantrums in politics. I've seen tantrums just in regular business. It is ridiculous. If I can step away from it, it is quite comical, but it's not really Matt: [00:06:36] well when you're emotionally connected. It's really hard to step away. Fawn: [00:06:39] So. Okay. Well, I mean, not just being emotionally connected, but  obviously you have to do business with someone, even if you try to remain unemotional about it and like level headed, it is crazy. Like, are you serious right now? That type of thing. Anyway. So back to Bruno's  , so I was sitting with my friend [00:07:00] who has the son that's out of control. And we're just sitting there trying to calm down and like, just trying to have a nice afternoon. Right. You know, how we would go to Bruno's and we would just sit there and just eat an early dinner before we headed out and did other things. Right. So we're sitting there. And Bruna comes from behind the counter. Like he's he was always there spinning and twirling the pizzas or whatever. And he was always busy, but he came, he came to our table and he's talking to my friend. He's like, Hey, give him info on his son that he didn't have. Oh, snap. And I was like, Oh my God. , this guy kind of like, I felt in a way watched out for me when I was a kid. And here he is, he still looks the same as the same youthful thing that he had. And now he's still looking, he's doing the same things and I'm looking out for this right? For my [00:08:00] friend. Who's the dad of this kid. I was just blown away, but that's a nugget of wisdom right there. That's a Pearl of wisdom, no matter your age,  that's the village, ,  we take care of each other in a way we are creating each other, you know, creativity, creative energies brewing, and very strong.  , I always think about collaboration and creativity, the way we influence each other in conversation, our experience with one another, they create an imprint. I can be imprinted by your behavior. My behavior could be imprinted on you, right? Your behavior towards me can create and impression of you that will be forever imprinted, , it happens in business with leadership, with friendship, all of the ships,  I'm thinking about one instance. If I'm going to talk about [00:09:00] business, I had this experience where this person that I admired suddenly had a tantrum. Matt: [00:09:07] Right? I mean, everybody can have a bad day though, right? Fawn: [00:09:09] It wasn't about a bad day. I could see it brewing. I was watching this person for a while because one, I admired them and two, because I felt like I was proud of them and I was wanting to just watch them to see how they navigate through life. Okay. Navigate through business and they're pretty well known, , they're, they're quite successful, but I was watching , and I was seeing little signs along the way that they could be wavering or they could be, , what's the word? Not necessarily being troubled, but like I could see a few hiccups happening. Right. And it wasn't a parents to people, but I was noticing  little tiny things in the ether here and there. If I can say that, [00:10:00] I was just noticing certain things. And so one day I had a question and it was the same question I had had for a long time. And it was always, , pushed aside like, Oh, we'll get to that later. So we're in business, like, right. It's a business relationship. And I have a legitimate question. I need to get something done. And it was constantly like, Oh, when you get to it, when you're ready, we'll discuss it then. Right. I kept saying, well, I'm ready. Can we discuss it now? Well, let's discuss it at this meeting. Well, that meeting comes up and there was no room for that conversation. So I said, once again, , I really need to figure this out  could we have a discussion or a call or something, but I, I use the word call as in, I didn't mean necessarily it has to be a call, but this person had a major tantrum. And I was so I wasn't surprised because I could feel it coming from months ago [00:11:00] and , I tried to not. Step in the way, because I don't know , what it is about me, but I S I, I tend to get the heat for things. If there's a whole group feeling this way, right. And it's targeted at maybe this leader, that's not doing their job. We feel like they're not doing their job. They're phoning it in. It's not things aren't being done. Right. And if I'm in that group, I get scolded. Because I asked what I think was an innocent question. Like, Hey, can you help me with this? Right. And then all of a sudden I get , the lashing. Is that a word? You know, I get, I get the tongue lashing and I get the whip,  , and everybody else can be like, Oh wow. That sucks. And meanwhile, I'm here shaking. Like what the Matt: [00:11:47] hell? You're very empathetic. So yeah, no, I totally get it. And you're getting now into leadership and how leaders process things. And so often I [00:12:00] think we go out into the world as babes in the woods and we don't know anything. You know, I have a four-year degree in computer programming. Big whoop. I learned some very cool stuff, absolutely things that I still use every day, but from a technological viewpoint. Oh my God. There's, you know, you could fill many encyclopedias with the amount of technological stuff I don't know anything about. And the trick is, is that a lot leader, depending on the style and the type of leader you're trying to be. I think people are very much locked into this whole, leave it to Beaver ward, Cleaver who always had a good answer. And , sometimes as a leader, you don't have a good answer and you need to be able to clearly communicate. I don't know. I don't have a good answer to that. And that's hard for people because when you're seen as a leader, people like to view themselves. People think that they're seen up on a pedestal and we've, we've talked about, [00:13:00] , mentors and things that ultimately, you know, I've never had somebody that I could emulate a hundred percent and that's just what it is. People  ended up being shite on one level or another, and it's really hard to be that hundred percent emulator kind of a person. And, , I'm willing to bet if you go digging for enough dirt, you're going to find it on everyone. Everybody screws up. And it's not about, it's not about how, how you screw up. It's about what you do when you do screw up. Do you double down and,  attack the other person or do you really listen to their criticism or understand what they're saying and say, you know what? I don't have an answer for you right now. I'm going to find one for you. Fawn: [00:13:44] Okay. Which you sent it because I was going to talk about. How we, how we always talk about mentors, . And how you and I grew up looking for the mentor and we never found it. So we had to, we had to pretty much do things on our own because the [00:14:00] parents suddenly didn't have any answers for, I think probably for the age that we were in, like the ages in society, like had changed so much, there's so much information. Everything is constantly new, but then yeah. You made the devils point of, well, it's always been new for the past century and a half. Like everything's changed. It seems that way for sure. But then we had mentors way, way, way, way back during, when the change started to happen. You know, I just felt like back then years ago, like a hundred years ago, there was, even though we, the change had started, like we had so many advances. With technology and we had the car, the phone, the backs, the cell phone, the internet. But no I'm saying how it started. Like we had suddenly there was a car, right? No more horse carriages needed. , suddenly we had washing machines in the house or a telephone in the house. Then we had all of a sudden, a [00:15:00] cell phone you can walk around with. Right. Then we have the internet, you know, all of that, like in a short amount of time, within the last a hundred, hundred 50 years, would you say it would take Matt: [00:15:11] a hundred years? Just keep it a hundred Fawn: [00:15:14] years, but yeah, but like I'm saying. It feels like a hundred years ago, we still have the journeyman and the, you know, the apprentice, the Matt: [00:15:22] dream things were pretty much straight line and odds are, you knew. It actually may be more about 150 years ago, because if you really think about it years ago, a hundred years ago, we were just coming out of world Fawn: [00:15:36] war one. But so do you see what I'm, what I'm getting at back then? There was that respect of like, okay, this person knows their stuff and they did. Right. , they may have had tantrums and other places, but as far as their work. They were seen as , the leader. Like you took care of business, right? Like, think about even the soldiers that went [00:16:00] into world war two and think about the population around the world, what they all sacrificed for. And I'm not saying, I'm not saying I'm advocating war. I'm not, but I, what I am intrigued by is how everyone pulled together for one common cause. And I'm saying there is no more one common cause, and there's no more one. Common kind of like a mentor in any particular field. I feel like. And if there are people out there like that, please let me know guys, our friends that are listening please, because I've been searching for forever and I have not found it. And so what I'm saying is it's not you. I was going to also bring up the mentor thing that you just talked about. And also it's also the capacity thing that we always talk about also. People don't have the capacity to lead. Like what is going on? Why is it that  , our leaders can't handle the job? Like you really, you have [00:17:00] one job to do and you're there to support. Well, do your people, do you have one job? If you're in public service, if you're a politician, you're a public servant, right. Okay, go ahead. You're there to serve, but I feel like. It's just, everybody is in, , the mode of survival. So it's take care of your own, that's it? Matt: [00:17:21] You know, where things get truly interesting. Doesn't it let's talk about politicians, Fawn: [00:17:26] but before that, I just wanted to bring up the whole tantrum thing again. That's what I don't understand. , I'm noticing. So for example, with this person that I worked with habit Dan drum, right? I mean, For net for forever. Now she is imprinted herself as a toddler to me, and the respect is gone. Matt: [00:17:51] Right. And that's a big one Fawn: [00:17:54] because I, all of a sudden I had to put aside what I had to do. [00:18:00] , it wasn't a job. I'm learning something. Correct. So we're in a learning situation and there was no learning happening. It was just phoning it in is, was awesome. Our perspective as the students, right. So it's still a business transaction. Right, right. You're paying a teacher they're supposed to help you. Right. Um, what was I saying? I totally forgot. Tantrum toddler. Well, yeah, forever. They've, they've lost my respect and there you have it and that's it. And really it had to do with communication, but I could tell, I, I had to stop. I had to completely stop that relationship.  It's not that I stopped talking to them, but I had to stop looking at them as teachers. I had to start looking at them as wounded screaming, toddlers, that need help. Right. [00:19:00] So I was no longer concerned about my questions being answered or what I needed to be done. To be taken care of, but now I'm like, wow, I can see her in pain. I can see that. You're frustrated. I can see that. So I'm going to try to erase that frustration for you. Don't worry about me. I'll figure it out. Matt: [00:19:21] Do you know what I mean? Yeah, no, no, no, no. You're what, what you're doing in essence is you're being a compassionate parent to this person. Fawn: [00:19:29] Forever. They are now imprinted as someone that is a screaming. Toddler. Matt: [00:19:35] Right. And unfortunately, or fortunately, or unfortunately, and mostly, unfortunately I think you're going to take a look at this person. Who's supposed to be teaching you things as I'm going to take whatever you're offering and run it through my filters and try and understand it. But if I come back to you with a question that's off topic or a question that's going to be challenging, I'm going to [00:20:00] expect perhaps for you to respond the same way, which really kind of hinders that learning process. Fawn: [00:20:04] And by the way, the question I was asking was totally in sync with what we were supposed to learn. Matt: [00:20:11] Well, and that that's the fun part is you absolutely believe that. And obviously this person feels differently about it somehow. So, yeah. Fawn: [00:20:19] And you know, that's where the communication comes in because they could have said. I can't answer that, but they didn't say that. They said, well, I answered that when you get to it, when you're ready. Right. Anyway, I don't want to get into the nitty gritty of it. But what I want to say is it's just interesting. This is all within the realm of what I was saying, that we are creating each other, every relationship, every interaction that we have, right. We are creating something. With each other, we are creating each other. And what is it that we're creating?  Do they know that they're creating that from our perspective that [00:21:00] they're now children and no longer authorities or leaders, they're no longer a leader? Well, it's because you're not able to be like, I, I always say. And it's going back to the other thing we talk about, which is be a good host in the world. The world is your home. And even the strangers that you come in contact with on the street, you were just walking by that person, is your guest, make them comfortable in your home. Right. And if everyone did that, it would be a different kind of thing. Very Matt: [00:21:31] much so. No, no, no. And again, absolutely. Right. I mean, on some level now this. Instructor becomes like a YouTube video that, , you watch and you're like, Hmm, that's interesting. Thank you. And maybe it helps you and maybe it doesn't, but at the end of the day, you've lost a certain essence. So, yeah. So I wanna like, I want to gently steer us now. Um, yeah. I want to talk about,  something that I've come into contact with, which has been, I was in an interview and [00:22:00] somebody threw these two words at me and I was like, what the heck is this? And the tours were. Servant leader. Ooh, what does that mean? And this is where w we, it's almost like we have to walk through, we're walking through a swamp now because it's a tricky, it's a tricky, tricky thing, because once you start adopting a certain leadership philosophy or whatever, I mean, you really, on some level, it needs to imprint on your soul.  You really have to believe it. Like everybody wants to say, Ooh, I'm a transformative leader. Well, what does that mean? What does that not mean? What does it mean to be a servant leader? What does it not mean to be a servant leader and unfortunately, or fortunately the servant leader, a lot of people have glommed onto it and a lot of people have tacked on literary figures, historical figures to it. And, , at the end of the day, I think , it is [00:23:00] what you choose to make it. So saying the original servant leader was Jesus Christ. Well, okay, fine. But if I'm Jewish, if I'm Muslim, if I'm Hindu, does that divorce me from it? Does that make me feel weird about it? The fact that people have said that, um, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Espouse this philosophy, the fact that people have said, Oh, my favorite author, Herman, Hesse, or sod, depending on who you want to talk about it, the guy who wrote Siddhartha, the guy who wrote a Magister loony, he alluded to the whole concept of, of a servant leader in one of his books, the journey to the East, which he wrote right after Siddhartha. But that's beside the point. And basically the philosophy comes from the fact that, , as you ascend the quote unquote hierarchy inside of a business or a, you know, institution of some kind that you become more and more responsible to the people under [00:24:00] you. It's not about gratifying your ego. It's not even about serving your clients, which wow. That sounds more than a little counter. It's about serving the people who report to you and putting those people ahead. People first very important concept and also to collaborate with them compassionately. So people come to a leader, quote, unquote leader, and you can be a leader, even if you're a quote unquote team member leadership has nothing whatsoever to do with your official look at a senior manager in charge of TPS reports. No, a leader is just somebody that people know are going to help them. It's a pretty simple thought. Help them. So it's about when somebody comes to me with a problem, not making them feel stupid because the [00:25:00] instant, I make them feel stupid. They're gone and they should be, I have no interest in talking to somebody who's going to be like, you don't know that, Oh my God. Or having a tantrum on me,  basically, you've lost your leadership as far as I'm concerned, which is kind of a scary world because if you're a teacher, but not a leader because. Theoretically a teacher should be leading a discussion should be leading people towards knowledge, as soon as you lose that, it's really, you can't get it back. First of all, I don't feel. And secondly, , people are going to try and go around. You circumvent you and you're in a very unhealthy kind of situation. Fawn: [00:25:39] Okay. So I'm gonna play devil's advocate. Oh dear. I. I'm thinking about it. And I think you can get it back, but if you keep on with that same tantrum, if you keep on with your rigid view, if you're not flexible, no, there's no way you're going to get that leadership back. Never. And Matt: [00:25:59] the reason why I said, [00:26:00] yeah, never get it back is because that's the rule, not the exception. That is the rule and everybody feels, they are the exception. Yes, you can certainly get it back, but. You gotta do something. You gotta dig deep. That's Fawn: [00:26:14] what I was going to say. That's what I was gonna say. You can't stay in that same spot in, in no matter what you've done, staying with the conviction that you are in the right. As soon as this person that I'm talking about came back with a lashing. I immediately, you know, this is how I've always been because I grew up with a messed up family. I was always trying to figure out their point of view, like, why are they doing this right? Why are they saying this? What have I done?  That's the first place I'll always go to. Right. so I went there again, I'm like, wow. So I understood her perspective completely. But in the end, it was still not okay. Like that was not warranted. That, that lashing that she sent my way,  it was [00:27:00] way out of line. But what I'm saying is it happens everyone's human to be leader. You have to be human, but so one of our favorite shows is Ted lasso.  Remember when Ted. All of a sudden unleashed the fury, the fury, and happy on poor Nate, Nate, the great, like, so here's a Ted lasso character. Who's  the most positive person.  He's a, he's a great coach. He's a great leader. Matt: [00:27:29] Fish out of water. He's in England, he's coaching quote, unquote soccer or proper football. And he was a football coach, like foot, foot Gridiron football coach in Kansas. And he's now in England figuring Fawn: [00:27:41] stuff out, but what a wonderful leader he is, and he never loses his cool except when he does, but he did. Right. And you can say, okay, that's it, man. If I was that Nate character at being like F you Ted lasso. [00:28:00] But first of all, that other character was very special and like angelic. So yeah, exactly. So he wouldn't have, he didn't let that get to him. He understood, wow. Ted's going through something. Right. So he was very understanding. Right, right. He stepped back. But what did Ted do the next day? He came back and he apologized, , he admitted that he was not in the right place. Right. And that perhaps he not perhaps, but he didn't, he didn't use what, what's the word for it? He didn't have the right way to, he didn't double Matt: [00:28:33] down on his Fawn: [00:28:34] Idiocracy. Right, right. He was flexible. He realized. He hurt somebody with his words, with his, not even his words, but his fury just like his face was like a different person. He just roared total animosity at poor this other guy. But you see, he turned it around. Right. And because he was human, [00:29:00] the other person was able to see he's human. That's okay. And he's still the leader. He's still someone I respect, especially because he just admitted to a wrong, Matt: [00:29:13] yes. But again, I feel that's more the exception that proves the rule. I think that typically leaders like to double down because unfortunately, or fortunately, or unfortunately the last, not the last, but one of the principles of servant leadership is that you are the moral authority. So, you know, what's right. Wow. That seems a little too arrogant for me. That's yeah, yeah. That's too much. Fawn: [00:29:36] Yeah, no, no, that, that needs, that's an outdated definition of what a leader should be, because we all have the moral authority. We all have something amazing to offer, Matt: [00:29:48] but by the same token, there have been moments in my career where I have talked to somebody who. Set me properly on the morals of the company or the organization I was [00:30:00] working for, because I remember I was working on a system and I was like, yeah, but if I have access to the system, then I can do bad things. And, wow. So I was talking to my bosses boss, cause it seems like I always tend to talk to my bosses boss, but anyways, smacked me basically psychically and said we don't hire people like that here. And on some level you can say, wow, dude, naive by the same token. I mean, he's, he's basically saying I'm we, , when you work here, you understand that you have this level of trust that you should not abuse. And if we hire somebody who does abuse that trust they're done and, , We're   going to do what we can to ensure that we don't hire people like that. So I'm not going to immediately say you can't do this, or it has to pass through some kind of official, no, because this was an emergency system. And so things needed to go quickly as opposed to, but Fawn: [00:30:55] that's beside the, but this is what I'm talking about. When I say you have to [00:31:00] be a parental figure because a parent needs to be stern. If you tell your child, Hey, don't touch that stove. It will burn you. You have to be very firm about that, make sure that they are aware of that. There's no wavering here, but if I, as a parent have a bad day and I unleash horrible fury where it's not warranted at all, even if it is warranted, he shouldn't do that. We should find another way to communicate, but I am human. So I immediately have to re. Redirect myself and come back and say, what I did was wrong. Please forgive me. Right. Okay. And that's what I'm saying. Okay. There's a difference between teaching, like this is the proper way do not touch the stove, do not steal, do not, do not do bad things with the code as, and then having. Having a [00:32:00] tough time and coming back and throwing your coffee at somebody. Do you know what I mean? That's what I'm talking. I'm talking about being human and it works not in, not just in business, but throughout all relationships, friendships. This is what is key. You cannot be rigid. We have to realize everybody is an authority in some way, and we are here collaborating. That's why I was saying.  We're creating each other , it's a, it's a flow. Do you know what I'm saying? No, no, no. I Matt: [00:32:30] completely understand. Again, back to compassionate collaborators, that's what a servant leader is supposed to aspire to. So they're not, I'm the expert on a hundred percent of things, but I am, I may be understand what the end goal is, and I need to make sure that I communicate that cause again, communication. So always, always going to be probably biggest indicator of success for any host leader. And you can sometimes use these [00:33:00] terms interchangeably,  it's about the flexibility and the understanding and the, and the compassion when you're going through even your communications, but certainly when you're actually,  collaborating with Fawn: [00:33:09] someone. And I think when compassion is left out, you no longer have leadership, you have a despit, correct? Yes. I mean, think about, um, if there's a disaster and a state and a leader suddenly decides to take time off, to get, to get away from things that would never happen. There is no compassion. Like I would not, that's not a leader to me. I need someone to understand the situation of the people, right. So if you're an army leader, who's never, you know, I've never been in the army. So I don't know, but I can only imagine you have to be a really good leader. You know what it's like to be out in the trenches. Right. How can you [00:34:00] possibly lead properly if you don't know what that feels like, if you don't know all the elements that are involved in that, or what's another example besides war, but like, remember a long time ago, there was a show undercover boss Matt: [00:34:15] and they might still be Fawn: [00:34:15] on actually, they were talking about this. There was this one show. Uh, the boss was, , the head of sanitation or something and. He wasn't he or she went undercover and they were driving the truck to pick up trash. And the person, the boss couldn't figure out why all of a sudden, , one of the people would disappear every now and then and hide behind the truck or do something. And so they, the boss, like who was in Cognito asked, and it turned out that this person had to pee inside of a water bottle. So never did the leader of the company realize, wow, this [00:35:00] person performing this job all day does not have a bathroom to go to, right. Something so necessary and basic for human survival. Right. Is that a good leader? I mean, obviously he put himself in that he or she put himself in that situation to understand things that he may not know about, or she may not know about, but really, or yeah. I mean, there are so many examples of this when you're absolutely right. , it feels like when you are not the leader, you tend to have more compassion and more sensitivity because you're exposed to so much information.  , so many of the necessities that are needing to be in place, those, those are what make great leaders coming from that. And having that empathy, that compassion for people and their survival. Matt: [00:35:53] Right? No, no, no, no, no argument whatsoever. And to take us back to Ted lasso for a second, what's like [00:36:00] literally like the second thing he did, he suggestion box. He fixed the water pressure. No, he put down the suggestion box. Right. Right. And even though he got tons of abuse because obviously he's Yankee doodle and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But ultimately speaking, he went through, he ignored all the insults and he, he, he passed that one off and he said, there's something we need to feel. Fawn: [00:36:22] Yeah. 99% was insults. Matt: [00:36:25] Right. And those just bounced off. And because that's what you, unfortunately you have to do because as a leader,  sometimes you're not well-liked, but he also said, okay, I don't know what you say by even implementing a suggestion box is there's a lot, I don't know. And I'm going to provide a forum for people to tell me. And at the internet has taught us anything it's anonymous, as you know, can be good. And, , he implemented that and  that showed again leadership and that showed that, , he wasn't afraid to admit that there were things he didn't know, Fawn: [00:36:59] you know, another [00:37:00] great key was he didn't take her personally. Obviously there was a lot of skew in that. Let's just use that as an example, on that football team, there was a lot that was wrong. There was a lot of weird abuses going on and there was a lot of, , inconsiderate things happening at all times. So for him to get a 99%, , insults in the suggestion box was just an example of. The air, , the sense of being that just existed within that culture.  For them to say, when going co-anchor, Rinker Winker careful, constantly. Right? Matt: [00:37:39] Right. I apologize to our British listeners. It's Fawn: [00:37:43] from the show. I know, but still, but for them to her all kinds of insults it, it's just indicative of the, kind of. Feeling of that culture that existed, but he didn't take a personally, right? He didn't, he just like moving on [00:38:00] and not just, well, I'm sorry, but I'm a great lover of TV and movies, but another great example is Elle woods from legally blonde. Here we go. I mean, talk about all kinds of insults being thrown at her, but like looking at that, the brilliance of this movie and the character was he could see her kind of like. Like as if someone's bringing a tiny little cute little belt, she would sh shrug it off and continue Matt: [00:38:27] on. Well, again, I think that they both embody what I consider the pop-up principle, which is I am who I am. , I think that they both have that strength of character in that they know who they are.  If you know that you are strong and you know that you are fit and you know that you were beautiful, if somebody calls you ugly, you're like, wow, I guess you're having a bad day, dude. You know what I mean? I mean, it's, it makes it easier once you come to grips with exactly who you are Fawn: [00:38:55] and knowing that when people are hurling, insults and [00:39:00] tantrums, It's really all about them and their pain, right. Has nothing to do with you. But for some reason you may be a good target for them. Well, because maybe because you do have that leadership within yourself that, that compassion, that empathy. you may feel like a mother to them so they could have their toddler tantrum, Matt: [00:39:21] right? Well, yes, but sometimes you instigate that tantrum. I'm remembering an incident. Are you saying you, as in me, I'm saying that I'm saying you as in me, actually I can remember an incident where. We were going through, we were reviewing code blah, blah, blah. That means I'm looking very deeply at what's going on and I'm asking questions and I'm trying to get to the root of something. And another developer was presenting and he was a father and he was older than me and dah, dah, dah, dah, right. Theoretically more mature. And he just, at one point I was like, so is this what's happening? And he got. And he had a tantrum right in front of me. And because of what I said, because [00:40:00] I think what he wanted to hear was brilliant code. You're a good guy. That's like your Fawn: [00:40:05] fault. That was not your, again. That was not you instigating. I know you were not the instigator pulled it out of him. No, you didn't. Matt: [00:40:14] Babe. If nobody would've said Fawn: [00:40:15] anything, you wouldn't have had, someone would have said something or a pin might've dropped and he would have lost his brick and that as possible, you cannot blame that on me. You sound blaming Matt: [00:40:25] myself for it. But I am saying that I do instigate something. Yeah. Fawn: [00:40:28] That's what I'm saying. That was not you instigating, unless you said, yo, you suck and you did not say that. No. What people have to understand is no that you were not instigating this. It would have happened either way. All right. If it wasn't you, it could have been his wife or his partner, whatever it could have been his dog, it could have been some person on the road driving, you know, it will have gotten unleashed in some other ways [00:41:00] what I'm saying, and that brings us back to capacity. When someone is full, they have no longer the ability to hold something which means understand something to have empathy. There is no room for empathy that that will result in a tantrum or disease. Like they have a heart attack because it's just building up. Do you understand? Yes, you are not the instigator. Matt: [00:41:28] It's not like I'm holding on to this. Fawn: [00:41:29] I'm just saying, I'm just talking for our friends out there too. And for myself, Matt: [00:41:34] you know, hammering home in a woman. No, Fawn: [00:41:36] because I mean, that's totally, no, we cannot assume the responsibility for someone's tantrums. If someone is having a tantrum because they're in pain, it has nothing to do with you. And I want people to understand that in a way I'm also repeating it for myself to remember that. Matt: [00:41:56] Right. Well, no, it's, it's certainly, you know, [00:42:00] people have just a plethora of options to respond to whatever it is I say to them. And sometimes, , once in a blue moon, somebody reacts in the worst possible Fawn: [00:42:09] way. Remember what, okay. All great martial artists say this, but also since they chicken legs would say it. That. Hey, he was, he was decent come. I just said, I just said, Mark, great martial artists say this, including some chicken colluding. I thought you said. And Oh, maybe I did. I don't know. Okay. So he was still great. All right. But since I chicken legs would always say that the best moves are the easiest moves, right? When you're lazy, I'm lazy. So when you're tired, when your muscles are exhausted, you just. You do things better in a way you're more flexible. You're more able to, you're more apt to go with the flow. Correct? That is tough. How else would you describe  all right. So I'm thinking of really old people [00:43:00] and they tend to have more patients. Why is that? Maybe because they're fricking tired. Do you know what I mean? And they can surpass all that BS and say, this is some ridiculousness. I'm not going to participate, but this is what's up. You know what I mean? Yeah, no, no, no, no, I get it. Yeah. So to come to that state of laziness about it, that laziness, like, I don't care about you. I'm not going to do anything laziness as in martial arts aspect of laziness and that you're not going to engage with. Coming back with the same force or if not a bigger forest combat, right. It's not about combat, it's about a flow. And it's about that. Engaging in that. I really want to say the bad word, but not engaging in the messed up stuff. Right. It's about. What's the common thing in Ikea. We did, when someone's attacking you, we let them go on their [00:44:00] way. If they really want to go this way, please help them, allow them to keep going that way. And sometimes even faster. Can you explain that? I'm not saying it right. Matt: [00:44:09] Uh quote-unquote and I Quito teaches us all attacks a or circles and B. They always have a direction, usually it's at your face, but whatever. So if somebody is moving towards your, if somebody is moving with a fist towards your chin, The worst thing you can do is stop that motion from happening. You certainly aren't going to let him hit you on the chin, but on some level, by the time they realized that their emotion was at your chin, which in point of fact, motion being circular, it's probably still, it's probably going, you can extend it up or you can extend it down probably up in that case. By the time they realize that they haven't connected with your chin, their hand is maybe behind their back and they're on the ground. Right, because you haven't said I'm stopping you from doing anything. What you've said is I'm going to let you do this to the [00:45:00] absurd extreme, which is going to end up with you on your Fawn: [00:45:03] butt. And without you being in the way is the obstacle. Right? Matt: [00:45:07] Right. I am not going to hinder that motion. I'm going to extend that motion. Fawn: [00:45:13] So another example would be someone is coming at you with. A fist up punch. You're not going to take your fist and meet their punch with a punch. It will result in an explosion. And both of you getting hurt. Definitely. One of you getting hurt. So what you're going to do is you're  stepping to the side a little bit and meeting that punch and letting that person keep going in that direction. But you're not opposing them. You're on their side. You're by them, your shoulder. So shoulder with them. Matt: [00:45:48] And that's that's that absolutely is one way of doing it for Fawn: [00:45:51] sure. So you're guiding them, right? They're not going to destroy you with their blow by you're going, you're now the guide for [00:46:00] them. And that's what I'm saying about leadership, It's all about you being the guide.  If someone is throwing a tantrum at you. To be a really good leader. You have to be a good mother and a good father and put your stuff aside. Not take anything personally, because this tantrum is happening. Just think about it. If there's a dirty diaper and they're screaming happening, are you going to take that personally? Like I instigated that poop to come. No, the person has poop. And they need a Matt: [00:46:34] change, right? No, no, no, absolutely. Right. And,  taking it to that level when the person is perhaps acting that infant, that with so much infantile , there's no good word. I can't find it.  In those cases, yes. You have to be more than just a servant leader on some level, you have to be the parent. Right. And I would say you're absolutely right in saying a servant leader does [00:47:00] indeed have to bring people back to center, but a parent has to do it even more if you will. Fawn: [00:47:06] Yeah. You have to, you have to find a way to have the capacity enough to be caring enough, to not take it personally and help them. Right. Which now makes me think of this person I told you about. And I said, okay, I'm done with them. Do I care enough to allow for something to develop? Right. Or am I totally done? And I, now I don't want to say the word, but, um, you know, what do I say? Am I done with this person Matt: [00:47:38] completely. Right. And that, that can be a tough thing, particularly in the friendship arena when somebody says something. So, you know, everybody has, I always, like, I was like to describe the fact that it doesn't matter how long you've been at a job, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. There are 10 words you can string together. God knows what they are. And maybe it's 20, maybe it's a [00:48:00] hundred, but it doesn't matter. There's a series of words you could string together that would get you fired. In the same way inside of a friendship, there are 10 or a hundred words that you can string together that will end that friendship. Right. You know, odds are, and, you know, uh, again, speaking about rules and not exceptions, cause I'm sure, but he'll be like, but my best friend who knows, maybe you've got something so utterly beyond special, but there are things you can say. , and it's about, , has that person said those 10 or a hundred words, or can you be big enough to ignore or move past that attack? And, , sometimes the answer has to be sadly, no, just to keep the integrity of yourself, if they so invalidate you that, , If they so invalidate, they strip you all the way down. Like I talk about how, , I consider my personality like an onion. If they cut all the way to the heart of the onion, can you [00:49:00] all the way in, can you let that go? And for me it's no, but that's me. I'm, you know, I'm, maybe I'm a fool. Maybe I'm an ass, but you know, on some level I have to keep that sense of self. Fawn: [00:49:14] And, you know, this is, this is our perspective and it's not the end all be all. Like, I really wish we had, whoever wrote Ted lasso that character. I want to talk to them because I feel you, how would a Ted lasso deal with Matt: [00:49:31] it? Right. Like cutting. So in, in, in, and, , they have the luxury of saying, well, yeah, but this is just a character and I can control who, what people say to him and, and what happens to him. And I can show him in the light. I want to show him in. Cause you know what, everybody has a terrible, and Fawn: [00:49:51] that's the brilliance of that character as they show him in the terrible day, terrible situations. Right. But he's still. [00:50:00] Is an exceptional human being he'll break down, but wow. He's still, I mean, I haven't seen the whole series yet, but you have, I really okay. Let's can we find whoever wrote that and talk to them because seriously, you and I, I think we have had enough Hertz where we're like, Hey, if you're going to reach this part of the onion, you're dead to me. But. With Ted lasso. Say that right. Matt: [00:50:28] Great question. Fawn: [00:50:29] This is just our perspective. I wonder what, what it is out there. Let us know guys, do you have anything else you want to say? Wow. Matt: [00:50:40] It feels like we've kind of covered. It feels like we, yeah, I'm sorry. I'm looking at my notes. It feels like we've kind of covered Fawn: [00:50:46] everything. It's just that whatever we end the show, you always say to me, Oh, you didn't tell, let me talk about this. I was going to wind it down and say, all right guys, you listening. I would love to, we would love to know your thoughts [00:51:00] because I mean, this is just our perspective. What's yours. If someone gets to the heart of the onion, Oh, are you done? Should you be done? Should you, would you, would you want to be Matt: [00:51:11] done? Can you look at yourself in the mirror? If you say you're not done and on and on and on, this is, wow. This is intense. And I, you know, for me, I am not Jesus, the Christ. I am not, you know, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. I'm not, you know, everybody has that moment. I think, but that's me. And am I projecting? It's kind of fun. Fawn: [00:51:38] All right. Well, let us know. Can we wind it up? We can wind it up. All right. Reach out to us, our friendly world.com and thank you to all our wonderful listeners. We're so grateful. We're really starting to pop around the world and I'm just in all of you. Thank you for listening to us. Please [00:52:00] send us notes and Matt: [00:52:02] rate our podcast. Yeah. Can you Fawn: [00:52:04] please, um, leave five stars? Can I say it? Am I allowed to say anywhere between no, no, please. Maximum number of stars. Can you please? No. Well, what we're really trying to do is start a movement where we create a compassionate world through friendship, and there are other things that we're working on right. As we speak. So. There are big things that we're working on and we want to work on it on a global sense too, to make this world more compassionate and to develop friendships. True, true friendships. So once again, you know, our website, our friendly world.com, please rate us kindly and, , leave us a review. Reach out to us because we need friends too.  Do you want to add anything by, by what? Well, we're [00:53:00] here. We never have an off, uh, we never go off. We are always having a show every week, a new show every week. That's our commitment. We will, if someday we ever get to have a vacation, we'll still record. We'll still have a show during the vacation, right, babe? Yes. As we love this, we love collecting. All right. We'll talk to you in a few days. Have a beautiful every day. Talk to you later. Be well bye-bye bye.  

Episode Sit Still! Nugget of wisdom from Santa Monica: Petite Sensei  (Francoise Petite)– make yourself at home in the uncomfortableness. We talk about being comfortable in the many forms being comfortable and uncomfortableness exists. Fawn brings up her friend Eowyn and the subject of being comfortable with money no matter where you sit in the financial realm. How does being still and not being still; multitasking contribute to loneliness? How can the alarm clock help you? Capacity is a big factor in the loneliness epidemic or in people having their relationships fractured. We don't have enough capacity to be able to offer anything to anyone else.  When you have so many things vying for your attention, you end up with a piece of over here, a piece of you over there, and you're not there.  You're not present. You're scattered throughout all these other places and tasks.  And that's where you are fragmented all over the place. So you're not able to totally be with your kids a hundred percent and not to be there for your friends. So you can't notice that one look that you need to notice that would quite possibly save someone's life, or a look someone will give in a split second that gives you information. You'll miss out on stuff like that.  And that's being distracted. We are distracted from each other.

Show notes Episode 33 “Capacity - moving to expansiveness – neuroscience, neurobiology and the social engagement system” with our guest Pamela Stokes There is a connection far beyond our bodies. There is a part of the neuroscience and the neurobiology that is called the social engagement system. And it's a grouping of five different things in our physiology that allows us to connect with ourselves. But also to connect with each other   This week we get into the neuroscience of our connections with one another and we figure out how to begin the healing process for our society.  Some topics include: the science of brain and body, trauma based therapeutic movement and brain training, movement and neuroplasticity, mindful motion, the insula cortex and how it is the key that allows us to connect with others. This episode is really big on more than one level. It's a little over 90 minutes, but it's packed with techniques that will help our world. Trust me when I say, you don't want to miss a minute of it. We begin with the question of how to get out of operating from full capacity mode (meaning we all have so much on our “plate” from responsibilities, to worries and thoughts, to trauma, fear, and pain) and unable to be open to others, to getting to an embracing, loving, giving state; getting back to social engagements and selfless constructs, after so much we have been through. Also, can trauma actually be beneficial? How can we be there for each other (as a society) when we are all in pain? Who gets to go first in being heard and cared for, when we all need comforting and help? Today, we have some answers that will begin this process. Guys, everything is going to be OK! - more than OK, actually!  to connect with Pamela  https://www.linkedin.com/in/moveintoresilience/ https://www.moveintoresilience.com/about-pamela/   Let's connect! Email us through: www.ourfriendlyworld.com  and also: www.ourfriendlyworldpodcast.com Please leave us a review on iTunes to help our podcast reach more people. Thank you, Fawn and Matt

We talk about rituals in life from big rituals to small rituals. We can develop connections with people when there's a ritual, and it can be the ritual having a cup of coffee, taking a walk, going to the farmer's market or sharing a table is a beautiful ritual. And that's one of the things I would like to say is, we can benefit from getting  in the habit of sharing what we're not comfortable sharing until we're comfortable at it; for example, sharing a table with a stranger. This brings us to this episode's nugget of wisdom from our mentor, Santa Monica. Today's topic stems from Musashi Miyamoto and the “A Book of Five Rings” as we discuss the fifth rule: “Distinguish between gain and loss in worldly matters.” Capacity. We define it. We analyze it and we come to the conclusion that love has infinite capacity.

Episode 31 “Unseen Forces” Perceive those things, which cannot be seen. Understand what cannot be seen by the eye. How do we access this information undetectable to the human eye? How do we access information beyond the five senses? That's because we have a six tenths and everybody, every human on the planet has a sixth sense. “Be patient with everything that remains unsolved in your heart. Try to love the questions themselves, like locked rooms and like books written in a foreign language. Do not now look for answers. It cannot now be given to you because you could not live them. It is a question of experiencing everything. At present, you need to live the question. Perhaps you will gradually, without even noticing it, find yourself experiencing the answer some distant day. -  Rainer Maria Rilke  Letters to a Young Poet.   Rachel: “Science is huge. It's a big world, science. Everything about being human; of frequency, frequencies, you know, there's hundreds of thousands, if not, who knows, maybe unlimited numbers of frequencies and all of those frequencies are part of this creation that we belong to.”   Rachel: “Being able to share freely our different human experiences, this is how we all grow and evolve together into communities that care about each other's health.” To reach Rachel Chevalier:https://rachelchevalier.com/

  2 nuggets of wisdom from Santa Monica: Calmly and reverently carrying on, holding your center in love, no matter what is going on around you in the outside world. It is an honor to be invited to someone's home. Treat it as such. We also talk about “entitlement” and what that means. What are we entitled to in life? This leads us to the topic of appreciation. This week we travel to different countries (via a book and our kitchen table) to discuss how we're supposed to behave in different countries. If we are in quarantine and can't travel for now, might as well brush up on etiquette from different countries. Which countries do you greet with a handshake? Who kisses once on one cheek and twice on the other cheek, hold hands, not hold hands, late or punctual, to gift or not to gift when visiting someone's house, where to not use your hands for gestures as you speak, eye contact or no eye contact, to say yes or no thank you when you are offered something, to use a fork or spoon, to compliment or not to compliment…every culture is different. We need to behave ourselves, understand each other's customs, marvel in each other's beauty and enjoy each other's company when we get together again.   Snippets from our talk: To take one step towards the next step; to go from left foot to right foot, is all about imbalance. It's a leap of faith because in between the steps, you don't have any balance at all; no connection to the earth. You're basically mid-flight. We work with that imbalance and get to a point where it becomes a beautiful, graceful step. Walking is really kind of this controlled fall. Everything is always in a state of imbalance. Just make the world more beautiful, and in a reverent way, hold that beauty until that beauty, that love, transcends everything. Even if you have misunderstandings and conflict, if it is coming from a place of love, it will be understood. “If you have no peace in is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other.” - Mother Theresa “Your words have power. Use them wisely.”  - anonymous. “Raise your word, not your voice. It is rain that grows flowers, not thunder.”  - Rumi. Reach out to us: www.ourfriendlyworld.com Insta: @befriendlyworld Twitter: FriendleeBe

Show notes #29 Friends with Money with Farnoosh Torabi We have Farnoosh Torabi, an honored friend, American journalist, author, television personality, and personal finance expert, as our guest this week. With Farnoosh's wisdom, things are illuminated! As Matt, Fawn, and Farnoosh converse together, Fawn realizes that some of us (she and some of her friends) live in a state of purgatory with money. We are trapped and confined to a memory or experience with money that unless we switch our thinking and snap out of, we'll stay in hell instead of moving on, thriving, having fun, enjoying life, and creating the lives we want to be living. We explore the concept of friends with money, by not only talking about how friendships affect economy, but also how to make friends with money as an entity in Fawn's case, because she feels mad at money (like money is this friend that has shut her out and she wants to be in that inner circle again), longs to be friends with it and get over a world of pain she experienced with it. Farnoosh creates a path to a major transformation for Fawn and Matt (listen to the very end after Farnoosh signs off) as they talk about what transpired after the show because of their time together with Farnoosh. There was not only a major money shift, but a miraculous friend connection with someone they were talking about on the show. Tune in! Some memorable and noteworthy quotes from this episode: “Oh shit, the universe was listening. I was like; I told the universe I was going to marry this guy eight years ago. It didn't forget.” “Listen, you're putting too much on money. Money is not anything. It's a rock. It's air. It's nothing, you know? It doesn't have opinions. It doesn't judge. It doesn't!” “It's not about you versus money or money versus you. It's like; who do I want to be? What is the impact that I want to make in the world? What is it that I love about myself that I want to amplify, and what I want to really contribute in a bigger way, and how can money be the tool for me to that end? And that is it. Money is YOUR servant. You don't serve money. Can you guess who said them? (It's Farnoosh Torabi)   Minute 40:53 Farnoosh tells an inspiring story about overcoming money adversity.    To support Our FriendlyWorld with Fawn and Matt podcast, please leave us a review on iTunes! Keep in touch: www.ourfriendlyworld.com