The Clearing with Katherine May

This week’s guest is someone Katherine has wanted on The Clearing since the very beginning. Sleep whisperer and ‘architect of coziness’, Kathryn Nicolai is the talent behind one of Katherine’s very favourite podcasts - Nothing Much Happens. Described as ‘bedtime stories for everyone’ it’s a show that combines Kathryn’s skill for storytelling with one of the most soothing voices in the business. The result is the aural equivalent of being rocked to sleep. Mutual fans, their conversation meanders gently as Katherine explores the craft behind the podcast. Kathryn’s childhood of wanting to feel safe, her ability to lift the cognitive load of those attending her yoga classes and skill in observing small moments in everyday life all led to the creation of her shows. That and an understanding that it’s not just children who need safety and to be held, but adults too. And no more than now. Kathryn also imagines a brilliantly dreamlike and mischievous getaway, that once again involves the idea of rummaging through other people’s belongings, and delights Katherine no end. The only thing to do is sit back and relax. If you’re lucky you will achieve Kathryn’s peak state of ‘so much time and nothing to accomplish’. Links from the episode: Kathryn’s websiteKathryn’s podcast, Nothing Much HappensKathryn’s bookNothing Much Happens InstagramJalaluddin Rumi https://www.oxcis.ac.uk/publication/rumi Bashō https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poets/bashoKamo Chōmei https://www.britannica.com/biography/Kamo-ChomeiRenee and Georgette Magritte with Their Dog after the War by Paul Simon here The Hitchiker's Guide to the Galaxy by Douglas AdamsThe Secret Diary of Adrian Mole by Sue TownsendUlysses by James JoyceMoby Dick by Herman Melville The Wolves of Willoughby Chase by Joan AikenOne Summer America 1927 by Bill BrysonThe Land and its People by David SedarisFind out more about The Petoskey Stone Katherine’s new book, Tending: How Care Binds the World is out in March and you can pre-order it here https://katherine-may.co.uk/tendingVisit The Clearing website www.theclearingpod.com for a full transcript, to discover how to enjoy our bonus episodes, our ad free episodes and if you subscribe, how to submit your own idea for a dream retreat.Buy Katherine’s books: Enchantment | Wintering | The Electricity of Every Living Thing: UK / USFollow Katherine on InstagramVisit Katherine’s WebsiteProduction CreditsGuest Booker and Admin Support - Meghan HutchinsSubstack Manager - Rebecca ArmstrongProducer - Alice LloydMusic - The Leaf Library @theleaflibrary

A friend of Sarah Wilson’s once told her she was always ‘looking for trouble’. It is clear from this episode that the best-selling Australian author, podcaster and TV presenter is hard-wired for restlessness. A self-confessed ‘edge-seeker’, constantly pushing boundaries in a flirtation with life, she proves a fascinating guest to discuss ideas of rest with Katherine.Finding the pressures of a small cabin or ‘being good at rest’ too claustrophobic and restrictive, Sarah instead finds ultimate peace being out in the ancient, Australian desert. The dry heat, crunchy dirt underfoot and minimal distractions in a monotonous landscape are where she feels truly alive. It’s the great equaliser. A place to feel what Oliver Burkeman calls ‘cosmic insignificance’. It’s also just one of the many extraordinary and often surprising places she has perfected the ultimate tent-life; much to Katherine’s horror who practically shudders at just the word tent! A truly original vision of rest from someone who has learnt to integrate work and leisure to such an extent that rest has been rendered meaningless. Links from the episode:Sarah’s website https://sarahwilson.com/ Sarah’s book I Eat the StarsSarah’s podcast Wild with Sarah WilsonSarah’s Substack https://substack.com/@sarahwilson Katherine’s new book, Tending: How Care Binds the World is out in March and you can pre-order it here https://katherine-may.co.uk/tendingVisit The Clearing website www.theclearingpod.com for a full transcript, to discover how to enjoy our bonus episodes, our ad free episodes and if you subscribe, how to submit your own idea for a dream retreat.Buy Katherine’s books: Enchantment | Wintering | The Electricity of Every Living Thing: UK / USFollow Katherine on InstagramVisit Katherine’s WebsiteProduction CreditsGuest Booker and Admin Support - Meghan HutchinsSubstack Manager - Rebecca ArmstrongProducer - Alice LloydMusic - The Leaf Library @theleaflibrary

Barbara Carrellas believes we can find the truest rest in moments of awe. The author of ‘The Book of Ecstasy’ says even in life’s darkest moments, ecstasy is possible. It’s something seeded in her practice of ‘Urban Tantra’ - a non-touch sexual practice rooted in her experience of working with the people and communities affected by New York’s AIDS crisis in the 1980s.As Katherine and Barbara delve more deeply into this concept of ecstasy, they marvel at the capacity of human lives for surprise and why sometimes we just need to step out of our own way. Barbara also explains why Tantra isn’t what we think it is and we get to hear the most beautifully unique vision of rest as Barbara transports us to a flamboyant theatre, replete with horses, Hollywood legends and an ever-changing array of favourite theatrical shows. A deeply joyous and uplifting episode where Barbara’s bottomless well of compassion, love and yes, ecstasy, is deeply present. Links from the episode:Barbara’s book The Book of Ecstasy Barbara’s website https://barbaracarrellas.com/Katherine’s new book, Tending: How Care Binds the World is out in March and you can pre-order it here https://katherine-may.co.uk/tendingVisit The Clearing website www.theclearingpod.com for a full transcript, to discover how to enjoy our bonus episodes, our ad free episodes and if you subscribe, how to submit your own idea for a dream retreat.Buy Katherine’s books: Enchantment | Wintering | The Electricity of Every Living Thing: UK / USFollow Katherine on InstagramVisit Katherine’s WebsiteProduction CreditsGuest Booker and Admin Support - Meghan HutchinsSubstack Manager - Rebecca ArmstrongProducer - Alice LloydMusic - The Leaf Library @theleaflibrary

Comedian, podcaster, radio presenter and bona fide history nerd Pierre Novellie joins Katherine in The Clearing for this week’s episode. A geekfest of language and ideas, they launch straight into the etymology of the word ‘dork’, why you can’t choose your own clown as a stand-up, and the politics around the changing language of autism. Like Katherine, Pierre received a late neurodivergence diagnosis. Unlike Katherine, his came after a heckler suggested he might be autistic during a live stand-up show.  A lovely, chewy episode for the brain, with Katherine bidding for them to be the hosts of ‘The Rest is Neurodivergence’ and Pierre sprinkling his imagined getaway with some Orkney magic. Katherine’s new book, Tending: How Care Binds the World is out in March and you can pre-order it here https://katherine-may.co.uk/tendingLinks from the episode:Pierre’s website https://www.pierrenovellie.com/ Pierre’s book Why Can't I Just Enjoy Things Pierre’s BBC Radio 4 show https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m002pfbr Pierre’s gaming podcast https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/button-boys/id1827054353 Baldur’s Gate 3 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baldur%27s_Gate_3 Kingdom Come: Deliverance II https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_Come:_Deliverance_II Portugese writer Antonio Lobo Antunes Night Watch by Rembrandt at the Rijksmuseum Visit The Clearing website www.theclearingpod.com for a full transcript, to discover how to enjoy our bonus episodes, our ad free episodes and if you subscribe, how to submit your own idea for a dream retreat.Buy Katherine’s books: Enchantment | Wintering | The Electricity of Every Living Thing: UK / USFollow Katherine on InstagramVisit Katherine’s WebsiteProduction CreditsGuest Booker and Admin Support - Meghan HutchinsSubstack Manager - Rebecca ArmstrongProducer - Alice LloydMusic - The Leaf Library @theleaflibrary

Caitlin Moran is somewhat of an icon in the UK. Growing up as the eldest of eight kids in a three bed council flat, home-educated from the age of 11, she became a published author at just 16 and a TV presenter not long after that. A long-time columnist for The Times, she has a well-deserved reputation for being one of the UK’s funniest writers. She is also a massive fan of Wintering - so much so her new book contains an entire chapter devoted to it. Caitlin joins Katherine for a conversation that was never going to be anything but brilliantly bonkers. They discuss her plan to rid the world of evil billionaires that basically involves being a madam, why she would pay a thousand pounds to hear the sound of a blackbird from Wolverhampton in the 1980s and ask; grottos - the Temu of caves? Her unique vision of splendour for her escape to the Clearing, involving ‘the greatest building that humans have ever come up with’, provokes a particularly visceral reaction from Katherine. Just to warn you, this being Caitlin, the episode contains a spot of swearing. Links from the episode:Caitlin’s new book How to Be Hopeful Outsiding Podcast https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/outsiding/id6782845808 Caitlin’s InstagramVisit The Clearing website www.theclearingpod.com for a full transcript, to discover how to enjoy our bonus episodes, our ad free episodes and if you subscribe, how to submit your own idea for a dream retreat.Katherine’s new book, Tending: How Care Binds the World is out in March and you can pre-order it here https://katherine-may.co.uk/tendingBuy Katherine’s books: Enchantment | Wintering | The Electricity of Every Living Thing: UK / USFollow Katherine on InstagramVisit Katherine’s WebsiteProduction CreditsGuest Booker and Admin Support - Meghan HutchinsSubstack Manager - Rebecca ArmstrongProducer - Alice LloydMusic - The Leaf Library @theleaflibrary

Step forward our first OBE on the show; former Children’s Laureate, winner of the Carnegie Medal for Writing, poet and prolific children’s author, Joseph Coelho.  Having both grown up on housing estates where you definitely weren’t pre-conditioned for a life in the creative arts, Joseph and Katherine marvel at the way teachers can shape children’s futures, wonder at the power of brutalist public art and relish the joy of watching people rummage through abandoned homes in post-apocalyptic films. A wonderful, and deeply thoughtful, conversation with one of the UK’s most inspiring literary figures. Links from the episode: Joseph’s website https://www.thepoetryofjosephcoelho.com/Joseph’s InstagramMunya Chawawa’s Black Boys Theatre Club Joseph’s estate he grew up on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alton_Estate Lynn Chadwick’s The Watchers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Watchers_(sculpture)Visit The Clearing website www.theclearingpod.com for a full transcript, to discover how to enjoy our bonus episodes, our ad free episodes and if you subscribe, how to submit your own idea for a dream retreat.Katherine’s new book, Tending: How Care Binds the World is out in March and you can pre-order it here Buy Katherine’s books: Enchantment | Wintering | The Electricity of Every Living Thing: UK / USFollow Katherine on InstagramVisit Katherine’s WebsiteProduction CreditsGuest Booker and Admin Support - Meghan HutchinsSubstack Manager - Rebecca ArmstrongProducer - Alice LloydMusic - The Leaf Library @theleaflibrary